Topic: Kane

[GreenBison60]

2005 i have heard some of the players say the same thing. And 2bison says the rst of the team should work on getting better than placing blame? Are you kidding me? That is what Kane is famous for, is casting blame at his teammates. He throws a pass 5 feet over their head and he puts his arms out, like what are you doing. He can't handle a pass and losses the ball out of bounds, and all is fine. He makes a pass to a teammate and they mishandle it and he is pi$$ed to no end. He brings things to the table but he also hurts in many ways also. And you say how did we do without him? About the same as we did with him. He was playing when we had our 2 worst blowouts of the year at OU and S Miss. We were 13-19 and he was only out 4 games. And i think we one 1 or 2 of those. I doubt S Miss would have beat us anymore than 56 without him and his 12 TO's that game...JMO!!!

[girthyherdon]

^^^this guy^^^ ::) ::) ::)

[GreenBison60]

I can't help you are in love with his antics Girthy. Everyone i have talked to AWAY from this board wants him gone. And i do mean EVERYONE i have talked to. Or at the least they say it wouldn't hurt their feelings any if he left. And i've talked to a lot of peopla e about Marshall BB.

[girthyherdon]

Well let me tell you something about "everyone" else away from this board that wants Kane gone. You have got to have a screw loose if you want one of the best Marshall players in the last quarter century to pack his sh*t and leave with one year of eligibility left. And for you GB60, you have this love affair with the "all time greats" of Marshall but you have a problem with attitudes and staying out of trouble.  Well two players I've seen you mention on numerous occasions have had their share of problems. John Taft was a widely and well known weed and possible coke user and your fav Skip Henderson is hanging out in a damn state penitentiary. So before ragging on Kane about his attitude "problems" and on court "antics", remember the so called greats you like to bring up and remember they actually broke the law, not Deandre.

[Herdfan2005]

Here is what the REAL problem is.  I KNOW what is going on with this team and I have mentioned it earlier in this thread.  The PROBLEM is Herrion, he should not let these egos clash and run his team instead of the players running it.  Guys and Girls, I know this team very well from coaches to the players and I would not lead you all a stray.  I know why we go after JUCO guys as well as why we cannot develop players.  Kane is a good guard but loosing him will not be a huge loss.  I really do not see him returning next year.  Honestly he would be dumb to.  He would have his degree and why risk injury when he could make some money overseas. 

[The Right Stuff]

2005 speaketh the truth Kimmo Sabbe.

TRS
MU 71

[2xBison]

I agree with pretty much all 2005 says in that post.  However, I do think Kane leaving is a pretty big loss, and barring a miracle big man showing up or Taylor and Canty being 1st team all freshmen performers it will be as long or longer a season than this past without kane.  without a good big, it may be longer season with or without kane.

[clovenhoof]

Truth is, we had no TEAM this year. From the top down, there was obviously no team attitude. I'd rather have less talented players with coachable attitudes, than the disgrace that took the court this last season.

[Swami Sam]

I bet he is Cincy bound.

[2xBison]

2005 i have heard some of the players say the same thing. And 2bison says the rst of the team should work on getting better than placing blame? Are you kidding me? That is what Kane is famous for, is casting blame at his teammates. He throws a pass 5 feet over their head and he puts his arms out, like what are you doing. He can't handle a pass and losses the ball out of bounds, and all is fine. He makes a pass to a teammate and they mishandle it and he is pi$$ed to no end. He brings things to the table but he also hurts in many ways also. And you say how did we do without him? About the same as we did with him. He was playing when we had our 2 worst blowouts of the year at OU and S Miss. We were 13-19 and he was only out 4 games. And i think we one 1 or 2 of those. I doubt S Miss would have beat us anymore than 56 without him and his 12 TO's that game...JMO!!!

No, it's not personal with you.  I don't think I recall you criticizing another player.  You are to obtuse to even discuss this with.

Bottom line, he was the only player on the team capable of giving alot of minutes at PG the majority of the season...so he played it out of position.

You talk about his Turnovers - his assist to TO ratio was 1.65, only one other player on the team even had a ratio above one and that was Manning - something like 32 assist to 28 TOs.

2nd team all conference.
1st on team in minutes played despite 4 less games.
1st average minutes per game at 37.1
as bad as he shot, overall FG % best among guards at 40%
3rd on team in average rebounds
1st on team in steals almost double the next closest
2nd on team in points per game.

Above are the objective measures.  You are just making yourself look even more foolish than normal Bison60.  His facial expressions and body language really must have impacted the team because the more I looked at stats the more I realized alot of them didn't do squat and he was carrying most of the team.

[GreenBison60]

Girthy....first i never said anything about what he does OFF the court. I am strictly talking about what people do ON the court. Those other past players didn't blame their teammates everytime they screwed up. And 2bisonKane was 8th on the team in FG% at .403 a game, not good. And 6th out of 8 people that attempted 3 pointers at .248%, even worse. And 6th at FREETHROW shooting on the team at .521%, HORRIBLE. Like i said, if he comes back, fine. If he doesn't, that is fine with me as well, because i think we will be ok without him. I'm sure we can go 13-19 with Canty and Taylor. Some are saying he needs to move back to the 2 spot. I've got news for you.....the 2 spot needs to be able to SHOOT the ball. That is why they call it the "shooting guard". Kane is a slasher but he is NOT a "shooter" and that is what we really need at the 2.

[2xBison]

Bison I said best among the guards.  and yes his 3pt shooting wasn't good...really the only weakness in his game.

most of the higher FG percentages come from the bigs...you do know why that is don't you?... i hope so.

[GreenBison60]

2bison you say the 3 pt shooting is the only weakness in his game? Are you kidding me? The .403 FG % is a scosh from being in the .3??% which is not good. And his FREETHROW % is .521. Do you not consider that a huge weakness? .521 at the line????? That is pathetic.

[goherdies]

Here is what the REAL problem is.  I KNOW what is going on with this team and I have mentioned it earlier in this thread.  The PROBLEM is Herrion, he should not let these egos clash and run his team instead of the players running it.  Guys and Girls, I know this team very well from coaches to the players and I would not lead you all a stray. I know why we go after JUCO guys as well as why we cannot develop players.  Kane is a good guard but loosing him will not be a huge loss.  I really do not see him returning next year.  Honestly he would be dumb to.  He would have his degree and why risk injury when he could make some money overseas.  

I'll bite, why do we recruit so many JUCOs?

[dnick76]

I believe he hijacks the team.  Ask John Caliperi how that works out.  I've seen a lot of MU basketball.  Kane is not that good.

[2xBison]

2bison you say the 3 pt shooting is the only weakness in his game? Are you kidding me? The .403 FG % is a scosh from being in the .3??% which is not good. And his FREETHROW % is .521. Do you not consider that a huge weakness? .521 at the line????? That is pathetic.

thanks for pointing out the obvious FT % which is weak, I was talking about his game as when the clock is moving/playing the game.  yes, the .521 is poor.  but not enough to make me throw my brain out the window on everything else like you do.

[2xBison]

I believe he hijacks the team.  Ask John Caliperi how that works out.  I've seen a lot of MU basketball.  Kane is not that good.

I think the ones aruing for him are saying, "he's not that bad" for the crowd that constantly bash him.  I don't think he's great or going to the NBA.  But he's our best and he led us to the NIT for the first time in 25 years the season before last.

If you will note, I haven't seen any threads started about how great kane is or how we can't continue as a program with out him, only responses to the obtuse angry women in the crowd trying to place all blame and criticism on him.

[Herdfan2005]

I'll bite, why do we recruit so many JUCOs?

I asked why they recruited JUCO guys and I was told that it was because CUSA was an older league.  I also asked the question about Huntington Prep.  They did go after one kid from this years team but he went somewhere else.  Cant remember his name though.  He was a big.

[The Right Stuff]

CUSA was an older league?  I guess that makes sense.  Their freshman and sophomores grow into juniors and seniors.  Actually I would like to see what % are jucos on the other league teams.  That would be a good analysis tool.

TRS
MU 71

[GreenBison60]

2bison i don't think anyone thinks that Kane was the only problem by a long shot. I can give you a list of MANY things that are problems that don't relate to Kane. But we get tired of how some of you are always talking about how great Kane is. He is not great by any means. He is a GOOD player that is a slasher but isn't a very good shooter at all. And shooting is a big part of BB. A lot of people could avg 15 pts a game if they played 40 minutes a game. I don't deny he is one of the top players on this team. But what is that saying about a 13-19 team? Until Herrion gets players in here that just keep their mouth shut and give it their all, we will be stuck in this type of BB. I hope Canty and Taylor can provide that boost we need. And like i said....our bigs were horrible. They were athletic but had virtually no BB iQ and skill. I just hope if Kane comes back he doesn't have the same "this is my team" mentality. If you want to "lead" then lead by positive leadership and not negatively placing blame after every one of your mistakes. I just want to see guys having fun and getting after it, not whining, complaing and placing blame like him and Pittman do. I would love to have both back if they could get that under control. JMO

[2xBison]

That post tells me you are getting closer to arriving at what you need to worry about, whether Kane comes back or not.

you mention our bigs were horrible, I agree....and newsflash is it looks like we are downgrading that position for next year unless a good juco big falls in our lap.

2005 summed it up, it's all on Herrion for me.

i'm done.

[girthyherdon]

But we get tired of how some of you are always talking about how great Kane is. He is not great by any means.

Once again, we are on a MARSHALL message board so what is the harm in talking positively about a MARSHALL player???? Please read the link below then tell me there's no way he'll be a Marshall great.

http://marshall.scout.com/2/1273885.html

[GreenBison60]

Girthy do you think shooting 28% from 3....51% from the FT line is a great? PLEASE!!!!!! I don't dislike him as much as a player as you do with your love affair for him and his horrible shooting and attitude thru-out his carrer.

[GreenBison60]

2bison, you don't have to have a bunch of bigs to be succesful if you play the right way. Now we do need to get 1 big for sure. But it won't take much to get one better than what we gave up. One of the problems IMO was we had to many bigs and not enough ball handlers. I would rather have guy's that can pass and shoot anyday than a bunch of bigs that couldn't throw it in the ocean unless they dunked it. I think we can be much better than some of you think with Canty and Taylor. It won't take much to be as good because this team had no leadership and no chemistry along with a bunch of bigs that had no skill. Like i said if he comes back, great. As long as he plays as a team instead of it's my team and do what i say. Chemistry is everything and there was none this year. And there was reasons for it.

[girthyherdon]

Not surprisingly you didn't answer my question at all. And I guess you didn't read the article.