Topic: What we know after Maryland

[parshall2marshall]

129 you are normally insightful, but in this thread you have lost your mind.

MD was traveling, throwing bow's you name it. It was travesty. Marshall does need to be more mentally tough though.

Could have used Penava. He would have thrown at least some of their $#!+ outta there. But 8-5 vs 5 we weren't going to win, whether we would have lost by 1 or lost by 40.

[Herdmeister]

Well, other than hoping some of the absolutely committed guys who think we're loaded with competitive talent will tone it down now, I've got nothing to say twice.  But once, to me this is the worst athletic embarrassment in MU history in well over a decade. Call an occasional time out when your team can't figure it out. please.

Did you miss the Ohio State game 2 years ago or WKU last year?

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[Herdmeister]

If not a closed practice, CoachSkip, then at least MORE COACHING and less "yuking it up" with fans from boards like this who show up at practice!!

Believe me, when the players are on the court practicing,  Danny in not yukking it up. He is all business all the time. He talks to us before or after practice

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[HerdBlizz]

When you play street ball you will have days when you get blown out.  As for the officials calling a bad game.  When all you do is cross half court and chuck up 3’s and the other team is driving to the basket they will get the calls.  Michael Jordan made a living from it.

[Herdmeister]

I'll tell ya what we know....

Elmore is over rated. Sorry but he is. Yes he is very good but mentally he loses it. Came down chucking up off balanced shots for no dang reason. Looked like a friggin FR tonight with his shot selections. His defense was atrocious. The guy from MD made Elmore look bad on both ends of the floor.

Kinsey and Watson both need to play more and West needs to sit down on the bench a lot more.

Williams is a beast.

George must have peed in DD's cheerios or something. No reason he doesn't play more than he does.

Bennett is a waste of minutes for the time being. I don't care how good he's going to be one day or how good he could end up being, as of right now HE SUCKS.

Last but not least some of you are the biggest whiners I have ever heard. Refs were not that bad. They were just a lot bigger and a lot more athletic. I'm sure refs missed some calls here and there but the crying from you all is unreal. Refs made zero difference in this game.

Smite it up I don't care. Truth is the truth.

I was at the game. In the second half, they were in the double bonus with nearly 10 mins to play and they had committed 2 fouls.
That didn't cost us the game, of course. It was missing wide open shots.
They played by far their best game if the year, I was sitting by a Maryland guy, and we played by far our worst.
It's one game. Like OSU 2 years ago and WKU last year. We came back and had a pretty decent year both years.
We regroup and support them Wednesday against W&M and travel to Athens next Saturday to take on the Bobcats

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[Herdmeister]

You do know jon was sick as a dog day before yesterday dont you?

He sure was.

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[herdorbust]

129 i know you are upset like everyone. I am actually shocked this happened. But please stop saying players sucked and stuff. Tonight was a gut punch but it will get better. We here of people in a zone. Well tonight maryland was in that tonight. And on top of it, we probably played as bad as we could ever play as an entire team except for jannson. Its over and we move forward. Last year at home against WKU looked just as bad.

[HoPPy785]

Man this place gets real toxic after a beat down. Sometimes you have a catastrophic meltdown of a night. Are we a top 25 team right now, no. Are we garbage and need to question Dan as a coach, no. Is it possible we are still a good team and maybe one that gets better as the season goes on, I think so. Step off the ledge, have a drink or something. Hit the emergency button if we go on a 3 game skid after this. Just like the players need to... brush this game off, learn and lace up for the next one.

[coalherd]

Believe me, when the players are on the court practicing,  Danny in not yukking it up. He is all business all the time. He talks to us before or after practice

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Then maybe the original post's suggestion concerning a closed practice might be in order, HM.  Close the practice, clear the air, don't mince words, and point out WITH SOME EMOTION to the players the problems/deficiencies with the performance versus the TERPS, who were playing several FRESHMEN in this game, and then put it behind the team, coaches and staff, and get ready for Bill and Mary!!

[MicDrass1]

4 and 5 star players go a long way in basketball.  Herd needs to take the next step up in recruiting efforts.  Terps had the better players.  Played a smarter game too.  Shoot when they are offensive rebounders présent. 

[herdfan129]

I'll still be there Weds supporting this team and program. Still not happy about tonight though. Also definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. I can't believe I'm about to say this but Bennett right now is not any better than Mijovich was last year. I believe in time he will be really good, but right now he is just a FR playing like a FR and needs to play less minutes. JMO.

[Kwherd]

I think I posted what was going to happen after win number 4. Exactly as I thought would happen. This is n9t a very good team unless sone peo0le grow up. Also, please Norte that this will happen several times more unless we are shooting 60% or better. No bigs, no rebounding.

[herd2win]

Time for closed practices and stop the good ole boys...we got spanked but not even a top 20 team...

[Kwherd]

Again, idonot know what you guys see in Bennett. A complete l8ability. Will not get better.

[herdfan129]

Time for closed practices and stop the good ole boys...we got spanked but not even a top 20 team...

So confused. What does open practice have to do with anything?

[herdorbust]

I'll still be there Weds supporting this team and program. Still not happy about tonight though. Also definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. I can't believe I'm about to say this but Bennett right now is not any better than Mijovich was last year. I believe in time he will be really good, but right now he is just a FR playing like a FR and needs to play less minutes. JMO.

Trust me im as deflated as anyone  But i am not going to start doubting if danny can get this thing rolling. He has shoed me to many times its not the end of the world. Why would we doubt a coach that won 25 games last year, first conference championship in decades and won our first game ever in the ncaa tournament against a #13 team in the country. Did we just get lucky? We have some problems now for sure. But i think danny will use this tape for a lot of good things. And its going to show the young guys how they need to grow up and get tough fast. And it will show the whole team how they panicked and started playing streetball.  It may take days just to get thru the film room.

[chris88]

I agree with much of the sentiment here.

- Yes we got beaten bad on boards but that is largely because we missed so many shots.  They only had 2 more offensive rebounds than we did. I realize many of theirs led to point blank 2nd chances but we knew that coming in and size would be an issue.
- I like the free/open offense but EVERY possession matters and we had guys not names Williams throwing up garbage shots all nights. Shots you should only be taking with 1-2 seconds on shot/game clock.  Rushed, not squared, trying to go 1 on 2+ over and over, poor passing at times.  All that makes it too easy to play defense against.  West/Elmore experienced enough to know you shouldn't be taking ball in lane at guys with huge length advantages...even on break.  Kick it out, bring it out, or develop a quick stop, short pullup jumper.  After first 11 minutes we played bad in 1st half except for a small stretch when we got it to 4.  The last 5 minutes of half and first 14 of 2nd half was just streetball.  That's the only way you can go up one point at 25-24 to down 40+ in 20 minutes of BB. Even last year we had stretches where we wouldn't put teams away due to shot selection.  I know DD wants us to play up tempo but i'm pretty sure he wants GOOD shots.  To be honest, even Williams rushed 3 shots I believe...two of them went in however and he played a very good game overall.  A good basketball story is a kid takes 3 half court shots in a row and the coach calls time out...he asks the kid what the heck he is doing, the kid says "I was wide open on all three shots".  Lesson is an open shot isn't always a good shot and a bad/rushed shot is never a good shot under most circumstances. Elmore has to know he is the catalyst and be more responsible. Watch UVA play if you want to see a team that almost every possession takes good shots.  When they don't turn ball over very few teams will beat them.  I know they lost in NCAA in historic fashion but they also went undefeated in ACC last year if I remember correctly.
- I thought the young guys played well the last 6 minutes minus free throws.
- The score was ugly but it's one game.  Duke lost the national champ game to UNLV by 30+ pts and beat same team in semis the next year. Duke destroyed UK in game one this year. It happens.  Give Maryland credit for playing well. If we had lost by 5-7 points it would have made us all feel better, but really it doesn't matter. Hopefully it will help DD get across that hero ball never works and staying within yourself is required to be a really good team.

[whf]

While it is imperative that the players learn from this game, I also think the coach can and should too.  Danny isn't one to step in and help manage the game's results; other than with player substitutions.  Sometimes we all have to make decisions that may be against our best plans, but also can save serious consequences.  Last night's beat-down was a very serious consequence and IMHO Danny could have curbed the impact by taking a few time outs and making sure he managed the outcome with the right players on the court.

If it was experience he was after, he got it. But just like so many on this same board crucify Doc for poor coaching, Danny has to take some heat too when it is deserved. For example, Beyers guarding full court at the end of the half, what kind of result did that end up with?  And not taking a time out after it was apparent by the two minute mark in the second half that we were "lost, and I mean really lost", what kind of result did that end up with.

Many will brush these kinds of thoughts off and say that DD's the coach, knows what he is doing, and just wait to see how the experience turns out at the end of the year.  OK, but just remember to give others the same; or step up and wonder what the heck he was doing last night too, just like you would with Doc.

[Herdalum83]

I was at the game. In the second half, they were in the double bonus with nearly 10 mins to play and they had committed 2 fouls.
That didn't cost us the game, of course. It was missing wide open shots.
They played by far their best game if the year, I was sitting by a Maryland guy, and we played by far our worst.
It's one game. Like OSU 2 years ago and WKU last year. We came back and had a pretty decent year both years.
We regroup and support them Wednesday against W&M and travel to Athens next Saturday to take on the Bobcats

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Except we were young and still growing 2 years ago at Ohio State. This team, has too many veterans for a night like last night to happen. We were not that over matched last night. This team is no where near 40 points better than us, but we LAID DOWN and quit. It was 38-34 for God sakes with 3 minutes to go before half. Clearly we could play with them but a couple of things went their way and we lost our freaking heads, stopped moving the ball and just started chucking up contested, off balanced or illivised 3 pointers.

When you're just throwing up long range bombs with no semembalnce of an offense (we did not run ours at all late in 1st or any of 2nd half) and you cant rebound then what you're really doing is making the first pass for the other team in transition.

As for the refs, I do not think they were good, I thought they let Maryland by with a ton of walks and a couple of ticky tack fouls on our guys put Williams in foul trouble and like the WVU game losing Williams killed us because we had no effective defensive inside presence after. However, we have too many veterans who have accomplished too much here at Marshall to let a few bad calls on the road turn into what this game turned into. You can't blame the officials if you lay down and quit and that's what we did last night. Pathetic.

[chris88]

While it is imperative that the players learn from this game, I also think the coach can and should too.  Danny isn't one to step in and help manage the game's results; other than with player substitutions.  Sometimes we all have to make decisions that may be against our best plans, but also can save serious consequences.  Last night's beat-down was a very serious consequence and IMHO Danny could have curbed the impact by taking a few time outs and making sure he managed the outcome with the right players on the court.

If it was experience he was after, he got it. But just like so many on this same board crucify Doc for poor coaching, Danny has to take some heat too when it is deserved. For example, Beyers guarding full court at the end of the half, what kind of result did that end up with?  And not taking a time out after it was apparent by the two minute mark in the second half that we were "lost, and I mean really lost", what kind of result did that end up with.

Many will brush these kinds of thoughts off and say that DD's the coach, knows what he is doing, and just wait to see how the experience turns out at the end of the year.  OK, but just remember to give others the same; or step up and wonder what the heck he was doing last night too, just like you would with Doc.

I agree with that.  Down 4 with more like 5 minutes left in half it should have been imperative to make every possession count.  I realize DD wants the players with experience to show they can handle things and play the right way but even great players need reminders.  John Wooden seldom used timeouts but he almost always had much better talent than the opponent.  I watch NBA quite a bit and Mike will let Rockets go too long sometimes too.  Most NBA coaches, will have a sense of when things are going awry and use a TO or two...even if it's just a reminder of what "playing the right way" should look like. 4 of our best players wanted to win so badly they played outside of themselves and sometimes I think Elmore is trying to impress NBA scouts by taking/making shots outside of the offense.  Coaches job to reign them in at times. Our guards are plenty good enough to break down just about anyone's defense....but it often takes time and requires patience during the possession to do it.

[2xBison]

These same rants recycle every year after a bad loss ....


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[MicDrass1]

We Do not have the same type of athletes as Md.  Our 3 starting guards can’t dunk.  Athleticism
Kinsey is athletic but can’t shoot.  Need guys with that athleticism that are better skilled.

[MicDrass1]

The officiating was lopsided.  It was bad.  The refs were patting md players on there ass all game long. Herd has limited scoring bigs. Foul them out game over. 

[MicDrass1]

Our most dangerous lineup is

Elmore
Burks
Williams
Kinsey
George

West - bench
Bennett - bench
Watson - bench
Sus tic / noooooo / upgrade needed
Beyers / noooooo / has 3 yrs so gets a year

[herdorbust]

While it is imperative that the players learn from this game, I also think the coach can and should too.  Danny isn't one to step in and help manage the game's results; other than with player substitutions.  Sometimes we all have to make decisions that may be against our best plans, but also can save serious consequences.  Last night's beat-down was a very serious consequence and IMHO Danny could have curbed the impact by taking a few time outs and making sure he managed the outcome with the right players on the court.

If it was experience he was after, he got it. But just like so many on this same board crucify Doc for poor coaching, Danny has to take some heat too when it is deserved. For example, Beyers guarding full court at the end of the half, what kind of result did that end up with?  And not taking a time out after it was apparent by the two minute mark in the second half that we were "lost, and I mean really lost", what kind of result did that end up with.

Many will brush these kinds of thoughts off and say that DD's the coach, knows what he is doing, and just wait to see how the experience turns out at the end of the year.  OK, but just remember to give others the same; or step up and wonder what the heck he was doing last night too, just like you would with Doc.

Again when Doc gets us to the equivalent to going to the NCAA tournament and winning a game then come back and talk to me. Not even comparable.