Topic: Alex Locklear to Utah

[duckhunterherdfan]

More questions and speculation would come from all that. Way more. It would also hurt guys on the team now, and be seen as more of an attack than anything else. The things left out are for administration’s eyes first. I said what I said at the beginning, a couple people either challenged me or had some questions. They were answered with great detail. Then there were the things I’ve just said will only be shown to administration. However, I know just about all of them personally too, so I know nothing will be done to fix the problem. What would I have to gain by saying this stuff and it being true? At least, informing you guys from an inside and behind the scenes point of view? At most, having the problems fixed. Sour grapes? No. Maybe sour for all the kids that deal with this on a daily basis. I’ve got a lot of friends that are still on the team. Lock wasn’t the only one. It was my hope that they would figure out how to solve those problems, like I said, regarding my reasoning for waiting until now. I’m thankful to the school for everything it’s done for me. I’ve done a lot for the school too, and plan to do a lot more one day, beyond just playing ball and everything that came along with that. This is the opinion of just about everyone involved. Everyone else is either too scared, in a compromising situation, or just doesn’t care enough. Take from it what you will.

I'm really not trying to attack you, but what I can't follow any of these facts that you have laid out. I really have no concept of what it is you're hinting at or the reasoning for the culture change and guys like Locklear not getting a fair shake. You have passed many things off as fact with no real detail to back them up. I understand you were in the program, in the locker room, and obviously have insider knowledge. I don't doubt that. I'm also not doubting you that there is a problem and the culture is not good, but without any detail as to why it isn't really fact. It's more of a Donald Trump, "because I said so, believe me." Why was Locklear in the doghouse? What did he do or did the coaching staff perceive him to do that landed him there. If you can't expound on these facts as to why these things are happening, which I guess I understand protecting current players, you can't be offended when people are skeptical. The questions you have been asked were answered, but absolutely not in any great detail as you claim.

[duckhunterherdfan]

To add to what the judge said, reiterating what I said earlier in this thread, we were set up for failure on offense, regardless. Our 2014 team would’ve barely won 6 games if doing what we were doing in 2016. Scheme and personnel. Selby, Dowery and myself were the most adamant and vocal leaders about changing what was wrong, as early as mid-spring because we spoke for the team. Every guy on offense was miserable and guys on defense knew what was going on and supported us. In return we were called selfish, only to have the same coaches that called us selfish, apologize when the season was completely over, for the very things we were saying for 8 months almost daily. After guys saw what happened to the leaders that vocalized an obvious truth, saw how those coaches apologized at the end, but then continued in their way as if they didn’t waste a year, they all became too afraid to speak up. The voice of true leadership is still challenged. Guys are stifled if they step on the wrong toes, those toes not upholding the standard guys like Roberts, Rouse, Jasperse, Vinny, Omar, Mckelvey, Hunter, Selby, Cato, Dev Johnson, Shu, Nev Hewitt, Jarquez Samuels, Cody Carter, and many more worked so hard to be the standard. Part of the injury problem was the scheme. The only way to remedy the problem was to play in a way where your movements were outside of technique and leaving your body susceptible to whatever came. It was literally gambling with your health.

This post makes more sense. This answers your facts with detail and gives them substance. Thank you.

[svherd]

If you’re talking about rev steve harvey, then he’s certainly not the problem. He’s been around longer than even doc. The man is one of the best men I know. And yes, deeper than doc, and within the team. I can only compare it to a cancer.

Clint, what about CL in all of this? In 2016, he just seemed to flame out at the end. Did the "concussion" do that much damage to his confidence. What was going on there? Was he a cancer?

And do you think Doc knowingly takes kids who may be issues/cancers within the team simply because they have talent and he thinks they can help us win games? Curious to read your thoughts. And thanks for all your insight.

[vanhorn78]

Clint, what about CL in all of this? In 2016, he just seemed to flame out at the end. Did the "concussion" do that much damage to his confidence. What was going on there? Was he a cancer?

And do you think Doc knowingly takes kids who may be issues/cancers within the team simply because they have talent and he thinks they can help us win games? Curious to read your thoughts. And thanks for all your insight.

Chase Litton’s concussion was a direct result of the scheme. In how our offense was ran, every time he dropped back to pass, it was a gamble for his health too. If anyone was the qb that year, they would’ve faired the same way he did and I think he did a heck of a job with what he and the rest of us had going against us. Chase went from being immature his first year, to being very mature until being undermined completely. Then he shelled up like the rest of us midway through the season. I don’t condone some of his actions, but then I also don’t blame him. Guys were at their wit’s end that season. The following season, he was given back part of what was taken from him. He started to get right back on track, gained weight, and focused on doing enough to leave the following season. For everything that he endured, I’d say that him making Kansas City’s practice squad is a heck of an accomplishment. I would’ve left if I were him too. And had I known 2016 was going to happen the way it did, I would’ve left in 14 or 15. Hindsight is 20/20, though, and I’m happy with how my life turned out. What I’m not happy with is the effect it has on everyone I played with and guys that still deal with the problems that still persist within the program.

[s1uggo]

If you’re talking about rev steve harvey, then he’s certainly not the problem. He’s been around longer than even doc. The man is one of the best men I know. And yes, deeper than doc, and within the team. I can only compare it to a cancer.

thanks for the answer, relative to Steve Harvey, I was just grasping for straws.  Relative to your other comment, about the OL taking their lives into their hands, did they change blocking techniques?  Blocking schemes?  Just interested.
If I said 'save the brain, to save the game' would that mean anything?

[vanhorn78]

thanks for the answer, relative to Steve Harvey, I was just grasping for straws.  Relative to your other comment, about the OL taking their lives into their hands, did they change blocking techniques?  Blocking schemes?  Just interested.
If I said 'save the brain, to save the game' would that mean anything?

No problem. The techniques weren’t the problem. Blocking schemes were just part of the problem, but still very much an issue. With the offensive coaches trying to do the impossible (their opinion as well, but only admitted after the season ended), we were expected to figure out a way to make the impossible work. It made no sense to us because those coaches went against everything they previously coached, mainly to neutralize Litton’s on-field responsibilities. They wouldn’t let it go and they wouldn’t fix one of the main problems, until after the season. I saw their apologies, coming when they did, as a spit in the face. During that 8 month span, they told us players that we were full of it, selfish, and that we had no idea what we were talking about. Mirabal called our oline a disgrace in a meeting after practice once during the season. Only to admit that we were right when the season was completely over. In all of that, they still held on to many facets of the problem after 2016 was over. They realized that they at least couldn’t limit Chase the way they wanted to, obviously, because in the way they tried to do so, meant sinking the entire ship.

[Echo 5]

Clint - I've been on this board for several years, I have to say this has been one of the most insightful threads that I can remember.  I'm sorry to hear of these lingering cultural issues, albeit not terribly surprised.  Anyway, I just wanted to say thanks for everything you did as a player, and also the conversation you have provided here. 

I think it is fair to say that 90%+ of the people on this board have never played D1 sports, nor work as a professional coach.  In that regard, I think most folks on here would greatly appreciate some post game commentary as to what schemes were used, why, etc.  I think your explanations will provide great insight for many on this board (and maybe even a few that don't think it's necessary  ;D).

Thanks in advance - and good luck in Law School and everything beyond. 

[lovetheherd2]

Mr. Van Horn, I have never personally met you but want to thank you for all the effort and passion and issues you handled for the years at Marshall. I have never seen or read a post as intriguing and articulate as your information shared despite the pain for you and others at the time.

Just a couple of questions.

1) have you or your friends on the team seen a change in culture with new OC & OL coaches changed? Or is it same old same old?

2) have you thought of any way to safely communicate your thoughts, or especially solutions to any Marshall person who might be able to influence positive changes in culture?

I believe I saw you and your lady friend walking at the Boca Raton at the Bowl game some years back. At the time, you were walking tall and happy. Sorry things ended poorly for you.

[vanhorn78]

Mr. Van Horn, I have never personally met you but want to thank you for all the effort and passion and issues you handled for the years at Marshall. I have never seen or read a post as intriguing and articulate as your information shared despite the pain for you and others at the time.

Just a couple of questions.

1) have you or your friends on the team seen a change in culture with new OC & OL coaches changed? Or is it same old same old?

2) have you thought of any way to safely communicate your thoughts, or especially solutions to any Marshall person who might be able to influence positive changes in culture?

I believe I saw you and your lady friend walking at the Boca Raton at the Bowl game some years back. At the time, you were walking tall and happy. Sorry things ended poorly for you.

The culture has not changed up to this point. I’ve actually communicated a large portion of these things to people in athletic administration, including Doc himself. Nothing came of it, as anything I said was brushed off. Regarding my personal life, things are great with another girlfriend... for now anyways. The former and I are still friends, though.

[Scottyo614]

Clint on the topic of 16.

Was the Chase Litton hit vs Akron the actual turning point? The team was up, things were moving and then one boom it like momentum swung and never came back.

Also when they have you all cut blocking there, is there any thought going in that the play has a lot of potential to go south? I’m sure probably not thought that bad, but you line up and you’re like oh no this isn’t good type of deal.

[vanhorn78]

Clint on the topic of 16.

Was the Chase Litton hit vs Akron the actual turning point? The team was up, things were moving and then one boom it like momentum swung and never came back.

Also when they have you all cut blocking there, is there any thought going in that the play has a lot of potential to go south? I’m sure probably not thought that bad, but you line up and you’re like oh no this isn’t good type of deal.

Not too long before that play, Akron figured out what one of those main problems was. The full slide/cut block (protection) would’ve worked if this particular problem (the main one we argued with the coaches over) was fixed. Unfortunately, it wasn’t fixed or admitted to as being a problem until after the end of the season. I can vividly remember defenses either vocalizing they knew from either film when scouting us that week, or figuring it out early during the games what our issue was. It honestly wasn’t hard for any one of the coaches and players, that saw our film or took a few snaps against us, to figure out.

[herd2win]

The players gave up in 2016...plain and simple..whether they hated the coaches or something else there was very little effort as the season went on...that has nothing to do with scheme that has to do with personal pride...it was if they wanted to prove a point and show up the coaches.

Anyone that was at any games the second half of the 2026 season knows the players gave very little effort...

[JudgeDD]

The players gave up in 2016...plain and simple..whether they hated the coaches or something else there was very little effort as the season went on...that has nothing to do with scheme that has to do with personal pride...it was if they wanted to prove a point and show up the coaches.

Anyone that was at any games the second half of the 2026 season knows the players gave very little effort...

If you want to edit your post to say that some of the the players quit by the end of the 2016 season, then you would be correct.  But it's wrong to say that about all the players, and extremely disrespectful to those who fought through every game that year.   

[vanhorn78]

The players gave up in 2016...plain and simple..whether they hated the coaches or something else there was very little effort as the season went on...that has nothing to do with scheme that has to do with personal pride...it was if they wanted to prove a point and show up the coaches.

Anyone that was at any games the second half of the 2026 season knows the players gave very little effort...

So in my last drive of college football against ODU in 2016, my shoulder subluxed twice... not once... twice. Selby totally separated his shoulder before that. Dowery was playing with probably the worst back I’ve ever seen or heard a human being play with... his whole career. That scheme (if you can call it that) made it a heck of a lot worse for him. Prove a point? Hahaha If a coach told you to physically hurt yourself on purpose, how much pain could you endure before you “quit?” Your coaches gave up 4 months before the season began. Then there’s the stuff outside of what the coach’s scheme causes. You ever had a hip or pubic joint cortisone injection? I’d rather my shoulder come out than have that needle inserted to inject right above your penis. Don’t get me started on the head issues and testicle swelling. Human beings can only tolerate so much pain. When your coaches ask you to go out and do something that directly causes more injury and pain, then it’s beyond your duty as a player. You have 0 idea what you’re talking about.

[herd2win]

That may be you VH but I drove 12 hours round trip and sat 5 rows behind the team against WKU and I can guarantee there were very few players giving max effort that game in route to a 66-6 defeat...that was not schemevor talent related... it was attitude.

[vanhorn78]

That may be you VH but I drove 12 hours round trip and sat 5 rows behind the team against WKU and I can guarantee there were very few players giving max effort that game in route to a 66-6 defeat...that was not schemevor talent related... it was attitude.

Well the scheme didn’t have any semblance of change until after the season, so scheme was an issue. The two top olinemen were injured and everyone else was beat to pieces. I was dressed out under my sweats just in case another olinemen went down so freshmen wouldn’t have to burn a redshirt, one of them being Mollette (the next guy in at that time). A back-Up qb was playing. Your coaches only talked about the next season during the whole pregame chatter. Not once did they say a word about WKU. Our play calling was very conservative as well. Offense wasn’t on the field very much, so that would mean an exhausted defense paid that price. Again, if anyone is going to be considered a quitter, look no further than the coaches.

[MicDrass1]

Well the scheme didn’t have any semblance of change until after the season, so scheme was an issue. The two top olinemen were injured and everyone else was beat to pieces. I was dressed out under my sweats just in case another olinemen went down so freshmen wouldn’t have to burn a redshirt, one of them being Mollette (the next guy in at that time). A back-Up qb was playing. Your coaches only talked about the next season during the whole pregame chatter. Not once did they say a word about WKU. Our play calling was very conservative as well. Offense wasn’t on the field very much, so that would mean an exhausted defense paid that price. Again, if anyone is going to be considered a quitter, look no further than the coaches.

Players  quit on coaches first.  Not each other.  Coaches aren’t getting it done and team loses, Coaches get axed.  It’s easy to see our football coaching is suspect. Been that way since Pruett left.

[JudgeDD]

That may be you VH but I drove 12 hours round trip and sat 5 rows behind the team against WKU and I can guarantee there were very few players giving max effort that game in route to a 66-6 defeat...that was not schemevor talent related... it was attitude.

And I repeat, there were players that gave up at some point during that dreadful season.  But if you watch the tape, even in that WKU game, there are several players in the fourth quarter still battling and giving all they have.  All I asked was that you don't throw the whole team in the same pot. 

In defense of those who did eventually throw in the towel, don't be so quick to judge.  In the WKU game for example, things went south quickly and then it must have felt like a landslide.  I know that's how it felt for me in the stands.  So as a player, you've had a tough season, the bottom has fallen out of the season, but you're still hoping to turn it around each game.  This game, WKU, will be the one.  We can still salvage something if we can win this game.  In the back of your mind you may not truly believe it, but you come out playing hard with every intention of success.  And then same-old/same-old.  It's not really a surprise that the things that haven't been working all season are not working.  But it's still a gut-punch.  I'm not surprised some of the players weren't giving max-effort in the second half.  Tell me, were you cheering as loudly and passionately in the fourth quarter when we were down 8 scores?  I bet you weren't giving max effort either. 

You speak here with such authority from your seat in the stands, but let me remind you to not underestimate the roll scheme plays in effort.  As Clint has been outlining, when a scheme makes no logical sense, has little hope of success, and puts players at an increased risk of injury, effort is definitely compromised.  Still, there were players laying it all out there.

[MicDrass1]

Coaches have to listen to their players.  They are in the heat of battle.  During the game they know more than the coaches.  It seems and I have thought this for a long time that our current Marshall football coaches know how they are going to lineup and call the games for the entire season before the season starts and DO NOT DEVIATE FROM THIS SYSTEM THE ENTIRE YEAR UNTIL THE FOLLOWING OFFSEASON.  THEREFORE, ZERO OR VERY MINOR IN SEASON ADJUSTMENTS THAT YEILD NO POSITIVE RESULTS (THIS YEAR THROW TO BRADY EVERY PASS INSTEAD OF DECOYING HIM).  THE GREAT BOB PRUETT GAMEPLANNED ONE HALF TO THE NEXT EVERY GAME IN HIS CAREER.  NOTHING WAS EVER THE SAME.  THROW YOUR BEST PUNCH FIRST, THEN MY TEAM WILL COUNTER IT AND KICK YOUR ASS THE REST OF THE GAME!  COACHING GENIUS.... AND FLAT OUT COMMON SENSE!!!

[HaveUherd]

Maybe our insider can comment on this:

Just wondering what is your opinion of Doc’s ability to make halftime adjustments?

[vanhorn78]

Maybe our insider can comment on this:

Just wondering what is your opinion of Doc’s ability to make halftime adjustments?

Doc mostly covers just special teams, which I will say he’s one of the best in the country when it comes to special teams. Your offensive and defensive coordinators are the ones that makes the real adjustments. Usually, other assistants will also brief their position group afterwards. That’s just the way Doc operates. I think they do an average job on offense and an above average job on defense. Regardless of how he may feel about the things I’ve said about the staff, Coach Price is undoubtedly the best defensive position coach to be at Marshall in Doc’s time. Arguably the best overall position coach as well.

[MicDrass1]

Doc mostly covers just special teams, which I will say he’s one of the best in the country when it comes to special teams. Your offensive and defensive coordinators are the ones that makes the real adjustments. Usually, other assistants will also brief their position group afterwards. That’s just the way Doc operates. I think they do an average job on offense and an above average job on defense. Regardless of how he may feel about the things I’ve said about the staff, Coach Price is undoubtedly the best defensive position coach to be at Marshall in Doc’s time. Arguably the best overall position coach as well.

Interesting... Coach Price is the man I mentioned on here should be named our DCoord.  He teaches DL to be nasty and aggressive.  I have always liked his coaching style.

[MUsince96]

Problems above Doc's head. This wouldn't be a Hamrick issue would it?

[Buffalo Bop]

Doc mostly covers just special teams, which I will say he’s one of the best in the country when it comes to special teams. Your offensive and defensive coordinators are the ones that makes the real adjustments. Usually, other assistants will also brief their position group afterwards. That’s just the way Doc operates. I think they do an average job on offense and an above average job on defense. Regardless of how he may feel about the things I’ve said about the staff, Coach Price is undoubtedly the best defensive position coach to be at Marshall in Doc’s time. Arguably the best overall position coach as well.

Glad to hear this about coach Price. His title is now Assistant Head Coach, Co-DC and DL.

[vanhorn78]

Problems above Doc's head. This wouldn't be a Hamrick issue would it?

Not really. More so under Doc’s nose. However, and like I said before in this thread, he was directly informed by me about as much as I could say before being brushed off.