Topic: Declining Attendance... It's not just a Marshall problem

[HerdEcon]

Boise and the MWC appear to have the same problem.  The article offers some explanations.  I offer another...  Conference television contracts with ESPN and others.  Think about it... 

ESPN and others are paying conferences huge amounts of money for broadcast rights.  In order to make those investments pay off for shareholders ESPN and others must get viewers.  Viewers gotten by people staying home to watch the game on TV rather than going to the stadium to watch it live.  Schools are caught in a catch 22...  money from butts in seats or money from TV contracts.  For some schools money from tv contracts has to be better than the money from butts in seats.  For other schools it's hard to turn down guaranteed money the TV contract offers over a number of years for money that isn't guaranteed derived from butts in seats.

My Friday conspiracy theory for the day.


https://www.ktvb.com/article/opinion/columnists/scott-slant/boise-state-football-attendance-season-tickets-down/277-d2ac52b7-3c5d-42ef-97d0-c2472ef010b0

[MUsince96]

That can't be our problem since we're rarely on true TV and make no money from our broadcast deal.

Even hardcore fans ask every week "How do I watch the game?". You think the average fans are skipping games to stay home and watch on Facebook or Stadium if message board regulars have trouble figuring it out?

[HerdBlizz]

I think Marshall fans are staying home to watch paint dry or water boil.  It’s more exciting then Doc ball.

[puma]

I always figured that was the deal with the devil to get the sweet ESPN TV money. Mid-week games are fine when your team is in an extreme climate and/or have little-to-no fan base. If you have actual fans, it better be a lot of money to risk alienating them. One of the positive trade-offs of the lack of money and exposure from playing on Facebook is that we get to play on Saturday with kickoffs appropriate to the time of year.

Attendance is declining everywhere, for lots of reasons. But for Marshall, I really doubt too many people are staying home because they can catch the Marshall vs. Charlotte game on their phone. Even for big away games that matter, it's rare to see more than 2,000 active streams. And I bet there's a big overlap between season ticket holders and those who stream away games.

[MUsince96]

Marshall's issues in football have been beat to death so I'm not going to rehash it in this thread. But I say there's a low probability games on TV are our problem. In fact, games NOT on TV are likely part of our problem. We've been out of sight out of mind for so long coming to a Marshall game probably isn't on a lot of people's minds.

[svherd]

Marshall widest appeal was when we were on SportsSouth every week. That’s what grew our brand and created fans. Then THN helped locally. Locally, with the decrease in the areas population and many companies not being around to buy tix for employees - Ashland Oil, Cabell and St Mary’s, Key Centurion, etc. it’s no wonder we aren’t seeing better attendance numbers. Young fans don’t want to sit for 3 hours and watch football. They’d rather surf their phones and all that crap.

Economics plays a roll as well. It’s no wonder the most full section of the stadium for the VMI game were the end zone seats - cheapest tickets.

It’s an issue everywhere that’s for sure. I couldn’t believe Boise didn’t sell out there game with us. Crazy.

[MUsince96]

Marshall widest appeal was when we were on SportsSouth every week. That’s what grew our brand and created fans. Then THN helped locally. Locally, with the decrease in the areas population and many companies not being around to buy tix for employees - Ashland Oil, Cabell and St Mary’s, Key Centurion, etc. it’s no wonder we aren’t seeing better attendance numbers. Young fans don’t want to sit for 3 hours and watch football. They’d rather surf their phones and all that crap.

Economics plays a roll as well. It’s no wonder the most full section of the stadium for the VMI game were the end zone seats - cheapest tickets.

It’s an issue everywhere that’s for sure. I couldn’t believe Boise didn’t sell out there game with us. Crazy.

With so many schools simulcasting their paywall games like ESPN+ or FloSports on regional and local TV. Hamrick/IMG-Learfield/Gilbert whoever needs to make concerted effort to get our streaming games on TV as well. There is evidence it CAN be done. If for whatever reason they CAN'T then they need to release a statement as to WHY. Because it makes them look like they aren't trying.

Before Goebbel left he told he was working on it in August 2018. Hamrick didn't respond to the issue.

[Flat Tire 2]

I think the younger generation, as mentioned in another post, doesn't have great interest in attending sporting events.

[elginherd]

With so many schools simulcasting their paywall games like ESPN+ or FloSports on regional and local TV. Hamrick/IMG-Learfield/Gilbert whoever needs to make concerted effort to get our streaming games on TV as well. There is evidence it CAN be done. If for whatever reason they CAN'T then they need to release a statement as to WHY. Because it makes them look like they aren't trying.

Before Goebbel left he told he was working on it in August 2018. Hamrick didn't respond to the issue.

I'm beating a dead horse past the point of mutilation here:

Either MH doesn't have a clue about how most people stream content OR he's not interested. That's been obvious since the 'huge' launching into the 'future' with Herdvision without the requisite apps for Fire TV, Roku or Apple TV. Sidearm Sports DID offer live streaming via a Roku app with the CAA and other conferences at the time, but did CUSA-TV???? NO. It's a f'd up product that was significantly overpriced.

Here's the problem...paid linear cable & satellite TV is on a downward trajectory. Every major cable company, Direct TV & Dish are all losing subscribers at an increasing rate. Marshall's AD, and the CUSA as a whole, need recognize this and join the 2010's.

[Huffnagel]

To beat another dead horse, ticket prices are a concern. Heck, Wake Forest has season tickets starting at $88 for 6 home games, they play in the ACC, and had Notre Dame playing in their stadium this year.

Marshall needs to find out the supply versus demand equation for home games. Like someone said above, the end zone was full, because those are the cheapest ticket prices.

[svherd]

I could care less about streaming. No fan outside of a Marshall fan will scour the web looking for a Marshall streamed game. Now if we were on traditional TV, they may stop and watch while channel surfing. Streaming gets us nothing other than allowing our own fans a chance to watch. To think otherwise is delusional.

[HerdEcon]

Anyone know how the streaming contracts work?  I'm sure that Marshall or CUSA gets paid something for the streaming rights.  Is that included in the money Marshall or CUSA gets from the broadcast rights contract with CBSS or ESPN?  Or is the streaming rights contract a separate contract after CBSS and ESPN pick the games they want to broadcast?

Point being CUSA and Marshall is being paid something by someone for the streaming rights.  Those streaming services have the same motives that ESPN has to get viewers to watch at home rather than butts in seats at the stadium. 

[The E-Man]

I think the younger generation, as mentioned in another post, doesn't have great interest in attending sporting events.

Apathy has set in with a lot of Herd fans. Our attendance would be up, if we had a consistent winner. Hamrick has made it clear, it's not about winning a conference championship, but to win enough and win a bowl game. Then everyone should be happy and go home.

[Garbanjo]

Apathy has set in with a lot of Herd fans. Our attendance would be up, if we had a consistent winner. Hamrick has made it clear, it's not about winning a conference championship, but to win enough and win a bowl game. Then everyone should be happy and go home.

Yep

I prefer football as a fan, but my money goes to BBall and DD. DD is a huge presence in Huntington and at Marshall, and openly talks about winning a national championship on a shoestring budget. #Winner

Hamrick should get on board or get out of the way............DD won't be around forever.

Go Herd!

[GreenDaddy]

Marshall's issues in football have been beat to death so I'm not going to rehash it in this thread. But I say there's a low probability games on TV are our problem. In fact, games NOT on TV are likely part of our problem. We've been out of sight out of mind for so long coming to a Marshall game probably isn't on a lot of people's minds.

This sums it up perfectly!

[goherd14562]

Apathy has set in with a lot of Herd fans. Our attendance would be up, if we had a consistent winner. Hamrick has made it clear, it's not about winning a conference championship, but to win enough and win a bowl game. Then everyone should be happy and go home.

Summed up perfectly, all they care about is a meaningless bow games not real championships I have been sick of this for too long!!! If we can’t win a conference title yearly in this fcs conference Doc should be out before the final whistle blows and if we do that, if we do that we can not lose.

[elginherd]

I could care less about streaming. No fan outside of a Marshall fan will scour the web looking for a Marshall streamed game. Now if we were on traditional TV, they may stop and watch while channel surfing. Streaming gets us nothing other than allowing our own fans a chance to watch. To think otherwise is delusional.

There are large differences in 'streaming'...
-There is facebook streaming, which you are correct, will not capture the casual football fan.

-There is ESPN+, that offers a smorgasbord of games, which will capture fans with a passing interest in seeing what a team is up to...

-And there is streaming (Sling, Hulu Live, Youtube Watch, etc) which offers the same channels as the cable or satellite as 'live tv'. Often these streams are delayed for 4 or 10 seconds behind the raw downlinks...BUT are often of higher picture quality than cable or Dish Network.

AFA 'traditional TV', the number of cable & satellite subscribers is shrinking while the rate of cord-cutting is accelerating. To be fair, a lot of cordcutters are forgoing any sort of 'live tv' in favor of Netflix, Amazon Prime, HBO, Hulu, etc. So right now & in the future, streaming is very important element in exposure. And judging by the number of rooftop antennas in and around Huntington, '96 is correct in his assertions about OTA coverage.

[lovetheherd2]

There are large differences in 'streaming'...
-There is facebook streaming, which you are correct, will not capture the casual football fan.

-There is ESPN+, that offers a smorgasbord of games, which will capture fans with a passing interest in seeing what a team is up to...

-And there is streaming (Sling, Hulu Live, Youtube Watch, etc) which offers the same channels as the cable or satellite as 'live tv'. Often these streams are delayed for 4 or 10 seconds behind the raw downlinks...BUT are often of higher picture quality than cable or Dish Network.

AFA 'traditional TV', the number of cable & satellite subscribers is shrinking while the rate of cord-cutting is accelerating. To be fair, a lot of cordcutters are forgoing any sort of 'live tv' in favor of Netflix, Amazon Prime, HBO, Hulu, etc. So right now & in the future, streaming is very important element in exposure. And judging by the number of rooftop antennas in and around Huntington, '96 is correct in his assertions about OTA coverage.

My first 10 plus years in Florida, our community had the WORST by far internet pf anywhere. Trouble was Bankruptcy judge encouraged the HOA to sign a bad timed contract. Then Spectrum was looking for a community to sign up and generate enough $$ to cover running fiber optic cable throughout our zip code. We got a good deal, Spectrum then bombarded the zip code with offers to individual homes.

Now for over a year have been able to stream. I got Roku. It had Stadium and ESPN+, got to watch most games last year on one or the other streaming sites. This year I tuned in to ROKU & Stadium and get the message = no more Stadium. Facebook must have paid them more than the commercials they could sign up...... BUMMER.. "Woe is me"... >:(

[herdfan129]

My first 10 plus years in Florida, our community had the WORST by far internet pf anywhere. Trouble was Bankruptcy judge encouraged the HOA to sign a bad timed contract. Then Spectrum was looking for a community to sign up and generate enough $$ to cover running fiber optic cable throughout our zip code. We got a good deal, Spectrum then bombarded the zip code with offers to individual homes.

Now for over a year have been able to stream. I got Roku. It had Stadium and ESPN+, got to watch most games last year on one or the other streaming sites. This year I tuned in to ROKU & Stadium and get the message = no more Stadium. Facebook must have paid them more than the commercials they could sign up...... BUMMER.. "Woe is me"... >:(

Download Pluto TV on your Roku, its free. You can watch Stadium on there. That's how I watch all of our Stadium games.

[Thundering In MD]

This thread really temps me to get Tribal, which I am against.  Instead of focusing on FB vs. MBB, maybe we should focus on what it would take to get a Millennial to attend a football game like his/her parents did.  I doubt there is an answer to that, which I attribute to the failure of my generation of parents.  All I know is my kid got angry when I told her that we did not renew her seat at the Joan since she was going to Purdue.  She was pissed.  #Parenting

[lovetheherd2]

Download Pluto TV on your Roku, its free. You can watch Stadium on there. That's how I watch all of our Stadium games.

Does this work for Stadium if the game is shown as Stadium/Facebook?

[herdfifteen]

This thread really temps me to get Tribal, which I am against.  Instead of focusing on FB vs. MBB, maybe we should focus on what it would take to get a Millennial to attend a football game like his/her parents did.  I doubt there is an answer to that, which I attribute to the failure of my generation of parents.  All I know is my kid got angry when I told her that we did not renew her seat at the Joan since she was going to Purdue.  She was pissed.  #Parenting

I read you post first thing this morning and it was a pleasant surprise. Each day usually the first posts I see are negative from the same people who are predictably ragging on Doc and the football program. It is gameday in Huntington and I am excited to see the Herd play football, if I to allow unhappy people to sully something I have enjoyed for decades the fault lies with me. I think we beat Ohio today, I can't wait!

[Scottyo614]

As I had said in a thread it comes down to ticket prices. As stated by HerdEcon rights fees are playing a role in this. MLB is the example where ticket prices keep rising despite attendance falling. Why? Because rights fees. They don’t need fans in the stands to turn a record profit. The offset of this is commercials. Eventually fans will turn out from TV as ads make watching college football sometimes tough. I’ve been known to fall asleep during these and wake up missing the whole game.

At MU $95 for a single game chair back seat is higher than many P5s general seating. Marshall’s season ticket package is more than UK. UK has packages for $243 plus a $300 donation right now. Cincinnati has a 5 game prorated version for $100. 5 games $100 dollars.

I get Marshall has other ticket options, but if you want to see what sides of the stadium are full you’ll find your answer. You’ll also find their “premium” seats infiltrated with random fans who found a seat. Much like any product, create value and youll build demand. Find a good price point, create intriguing matchups, ask for genuine fan feedback. This is not a hard problem to solve.

[MUAlum2004]

This is a big problem for all schools but even more so in a city like Huntington.  The population has decreased all but one time since 2000.  We simply do not keep the college graduates and they all move away. 
I moved away in 2007 and have kept season tickets. At first, I’d drive the 8 hours or 4 hours most weeks.  Over the last 3-4 years, it’s just not practical and we only make 2-3 games per year. I’m still the anomaly as many friends haven’t been back in years or go back for one game.

There have been some nice wins for Huntington, but they have to find the industry to keep more students after graduation. For Marshall to thrive, it starts with the city and surrounding areas.

[elginherd]

Does this work for Stadium if the game is shown as Stadium/Facebook?

No, unfortunately.