Topic: And then there was one

[MUther]

Marshall basketball is the only sport left for me.  I'm done with football at all levels.  Haven't watched anything but MU games for a long time and they haven't meant much in a long time.  New coach isn't going to fix this.  Not anyone these assholes will end up hiring.  Will be ten years before the cancer is cut out of the athletic department.  We have no big donors left to force good decisions.  The ride is over and we may never be back. It's been over 20 years since we've been a legit team at a national level.  I simply don't care anymore. 

[whf]

Marshall basketball is the only sport left for me.  I'm done with football at all levels.  Haven't watched anything but MU games for a long time and they haven't meant much in a long time.  New coach isn't going to fix this.  Not anyone these @#*^!s will end up hiring.  Will be ten years before the cancer is cut out of the athletic department.  We have no big donors left to force good decisions.  The ride is over and we may never be back. It's been over 20 years since we've been a legit team at a national level.  I simply don't care anymore.
Does this mean you'll quite bitching about 100% of everything football too? That would be great.

[DC01HERD]

We need 20,000 undergrads we have under 10,000. The whole university has failed. We had a major Hollywood motion picture and we dropped the ball.

[MidlandKnight]

Nevermind.

[forphase1]

Marshall basketball is the only sport left for me.  I'm done with football at all levels.  Haven't watched anything but MU games for a long time and they haven't meant much in a long time.  New coach isn't going to fix this.  Not anyone these @#*^!s will end up hiring.  Will be ten years before the cancer is cut out of the athletic department.  We have no big donors left to force good decisions.  The ride is over and we may never be back. It's been over 20 years since we've been a legit team at a national level.  I simply don't care anymore.
Does this mean you'll quite bitching about 100% of everything football too? That would be great.

You are still here?  Figured you'd be too embarrassed to show your face for a bit after pumping all the Doc sunshine....

[wasbarryb]

You are still here?  Figured you'd be too embarrassed to show your face for a bit after pumping all the Doc sunshine....

Docsuckers don't know enough to realize they should be embarrassed.

[whf]

You are still here?  Figured you'd be too embarrassed to show your face for a bit after pumping all the Doc sunshine....

I'm a big boy, no issue with pushing back on my Doc support, but it isn't Doc, its the program.  And I'm never offended by debate, it's the personal bullshix about sucking dics and etc. that I won't let fly.  To attack people personally on a fan board is unnecessary and gains the university and it's supporters nothing IMHO.

[whf]

Docsuckers don't know enough to realize they should be embarrassed.

Here we go again.

[forphase1]

I'm a big boy, no issue with pushing back on my Doc support, but it isn't Doc, its the program.  And I'm never offended by debate, it's the personal bullshix about sucking dics and etc. that I won't let fly.  To attack people personally on a fan board is like sucking your own... as it shows just how low you can bough.

Right now Doc IS the program.  They are one and the same.  You really can't support one without supporting the other.  If we support the program, then we are supporting the crap that Doc is putting on the field right now.  I'd love to give Marshall my time, effort and money again.  But I can not support a program who keeps a coach like Doc around.  That simple.  Emotions are high right now, and yes, personal attacks go too far, and for that I apologize.  But it doesn't change the facts that all the Doc supporters are wrong, plain and simple.  We ALL Need to band together and DEMAND change.  It's way past time.

[whf]

Right now Doc IS the program.  They are one and the same.  You really can't support one without supporting the other.  If we support the program, then we are supporting the crap that Doc is putting on the field right now.  I'd love to give Marshall my time, effort and money again.  But I can not support a program who keeps a coach like Doc around.  That simple.  Emotions are high right now, and yes, personal attacks go too far, and for that I apologize.  But it doesn't change the facts that all the Doc supporters are wrong, plain and simple.  We ALL Need to band together and DEMAND change.  It's way past time.

I agree that Doc is the face of the program, and that all of us are contributing to the condition of it. Whether he's there or not, people on this board aren't going to get him fired.  If we want him fired, it has to be with dialogue inside the AD, not by attacking him and others as if they are dumb (@/:; and aren't capable of understanding what is going on. 

Personally, I want him gone too, but not because I think he can't coach; it's because the department is stale and he severely lacks communications skills that are needed with fans, the media, and most players today.  It isn't his coaching abilities, or his leadership abilities that bother me, its his "selling skills" and lack of being able to generate enthusiasm and support from the fan base.

[forphase1]

I agree with most of this, with 2 exceptions.  1) the way we CAN make them pay attention is with our $$$.  But too many are still donating money and going to games to force them into making the right decision.  Yes, it will hurt Marshall to pull support, but if that is what it takes to FORCE change upon the AD, then so be it.  Yes, that dialogue has to take place within the AD, but we can force that discussion to take place and shape the manner of that discussion by our $$$.  If 1/2 of the Big Green called on Monday and cancelled their Big Green memberships, and all said they will resume donating if Doc is gone, tell me that wouldn't get attention?  Of course it would.  2) I don't think Doc can coach.  I think at times he's able to out talent the other team, like with Cato and Shuler.  And it helps we play in the worse conference in the country where you sometimes CAN out talent the other team.  But I think he's a very poor coach, and only a slightly above average recruiter.  But that's enough to average 8-4, 7-5 in this piss poor conference. 

[MidlandKnight]

I agree that Doc is the face of the program, and that all of us are contributing to the condition of it. Whether he's there or not, people on this board aren't going to get him fired.  If we want him fired, it has to be with dialogue inside the AD, not by attacking him and others as if they are dumb (@/:; and aren't capable of understanding what is going on. 

Personally, I want him gone too, but not because I think he can't coach; it's because the department is stale and he severely lacks communications skills that are needed with fans, the media, and most players today. It isn't his coaching abilities, or his leadership abilities that bother me, its his "selling skills" and lack of being able to generate enthusiasm and support from the fan base.

Agree. I have spoke to DOC twice in my life. While he was very nice he spoke in a monotone way..... Both times I kept wondering how does he convince recruits to come here and players to play?

[Always THE HERD]

And today I hear that the school up north is now going to be in "cahoots(sp)? with Princeton Community Hospital. Why did MU not attempt something like this. They also partnered with Summersville hospital..........is there nothing else MU can do to "grow" the name, etc.?

[coalherd]

I agree with most of this, with 2 exceptions.  1) the way we CAN make them pay attention is with our $$$.  But too many are still donating money and going to games to force them into making the right decision.  Yes, it will hurt Marshall to pull support, but if that is what it takes to FORCE change upon the AD, then so be it.  Yes, that dialogue has to take place within the AD, but we can force that discussion to take place and shape the manner of that discussion by our $$$.  If 1/2 of the Big Green called on Monday and cancelled their Big Green memberships, and all said they will resume donating if Doc is gone, tell me that wouldn't get attention?  Of course it would.  2) I don't think Doc can coach.  I think at times he's able to out talent the other team, like with Cato and Shuler.  And it helps we play in the worse conference in the country where you sometimes CAN out talent the other team.  But I think he's a very poor coach, and only a slightly above average recruiter.  But that's enough to average 8-4, 7-5 in this piss poor conference.

Then it all needs to start with any Bowl the Herd goes to.  When Hammy's AD starts with their media, HERD ZONE, e-mail promos and drive to sell Bowl Tix to Herd fans, supporters, alums, the general public, then the overwhelming response from all of these groups should be like the old, Nancy Reagan anti drug campaign stated:  "Just Say No!".

After all, Herd football under Doc too often is akin to being on a "bad drug"!  And for many of us viewing same, its like a "bad drug trip"!!

[whf]

I've modified my posts from last night and apologize to the general readership for mirroring others calling names and making fun of others. That truly isn't who I am, and I am sorry that my defensive mechanisms kicked in so strongly last night.  I'd rather take the punches than throw them, no team is ever enhance by derision and division. 

So to those of you who just come on here for dialogue, to share and care a bit with others who love the Herd, I am sorry to have made comments that added to the unnecessary discourse among Herd fans.

[herdorbust]

I've modified my posts from last night and apologize to the general readership for mirroring others calling names and making fun of others. That truly isn't who I am, and I am sorry that my defensive mechanisms kicked in so strongly last night.  I'd rather take the punches than throw them, no team is ever enhance by derision and division. 

So to those of you who just come on here for dialogue, to share and care a bit with others who love the Herd, I am sorry to have made comments that added to the unnecessary discourse among Herd fans.

WHF I will say from reading your posts that you are a really good person and I really mean that. As a person I really do admire you and respect you.we just happen to disagree on the football program. I just think some people are just to loyal to the point that they can’t see wrong. 11 years is to long and the style has killed excitement once built here. And Hamrick just comes across as protecting his buddy more than listening to the fans. I for one am done with both of them. And nothing can change that.

[Herd72]

We need to face the fact that college football, even in lowly CUSA, is a business ... a big business. If the product you put out does not excite and appeal to your potential audience aka customers then your business is doomed to fail. Doc’s brand of football, especially his recent and all too familiar debacles are instead alienating the fan and donor base. It will never put enough “butts in seats” to foster continued growth and expansion. He is the epitome of a failed executive whose company needs to simply “wish him well in his future endeavors” , take his keys, and give him until Jan. 1 to clear out his office.

[Daherdboy]

I was in the JOAN last night (Friday), and being OLD nearly froze my butt off.  After watching the first half, which mirrored the Rice game, to me it seemed to get colder and my body told me to get to warm conditions, so I listened and left.  All I saw was another “No Score” game.

With Men’s Basketball, like football, I’ve got season tickets and am in the lottery to get BB tickets.  But, I’m zero for five and have not seen the men play.  So, no basketball.

What am I waiting for?  SOFTBALL and on a little lesser note TENNIS. 
Don’t know all the new tennis players, don’t know their talent, so they are an unknown quality.
But SOFTBALL has the numbers, the hitters, and the pitchers (7).  Counting the weeks til March and softball starts their home games.

Only thing I expect is that fans will be able to sit in The Dot to see the best team on campus.
Come on Athletic Department, line up the seating so we can see the games.
I will be very disappointed if I have to watch games from outside of the right field fence.

[whf]

WHF I will say from reading your posts that you are a really good person and I really mean that. As a person I really do admire you and respect you.we just happen to disagree on the football program. I just think some people are just to loyal to the point that they can’t see wrong. 11 years is to long and the style has killed excitement once built here. And Hamrick just comes across as protecting his buddy more than listening to the fans. I for one am done with both of them. And nothing can change that.

What I don't understand, HOB, is that I often have contended that Doc needs go go. No one ever seems to hear me sayings that; they act like I'm in his pocket or something.  That is just not true.  I object to the personal attacks on him, the promotion that he is incompetent, etc.  And I struggle with what can be at MU in sports anymore.  What would be the result of the feelings about DD if he continues to lose like he did to Toledo?  Will the same tiring start, will people speak up?    I don't know, but if they do, I'm convinced that it will not be with the same fury and personal attack that has been cast on Doc.   Big donors brought us Snyder, how did that work out? 

My final comment on this, and you've seen it in writing from me (if you're honest, you'll recognize I've said this many times) is that our biggest problem isn't Doc, it's clearly the approach Hamrick takes toward with the general public, and the decisions made with / for the growing number of younger donors who are giving more now than the long time, older (but consistent) donors.  The re-seating cost the two programs a lot, and the fact that he looks past so many people who may have disagreed with him in the past is not overcome-able IMHO.

[MicDrass1]

Herd football can not win CUSA.  The worst D1 FBS league in the nation.  At least in the MAC we dominated and it was the worst D1 FBS league in the country but did improve greatly over our run.  All this means we need a change.  The potential of Herd football programs is not being maxed out.  It's just not.  Facilities are better than ever before and our recruiting dips each year.  Each year it's a new low with on the field results.  Bring back the former players with connections, form a committee and find and hire a new coach. 

[herdorbust]

What I don't understand, HOB, is that I often have contended that Doc needs go go. No one ever seems to hear me sayings that; they act like I'm in his pocket or something.  That is just not true.  I object to the personal attacks on him, the promotion that he is incompetent, etc.  And I struggle with what can be at MU in sports anymore.  What would be the result of the feelings about DD if he continues to lose like he did to Toledo?  Will the same tiring start, will people speak up?    I don't know, but if they do, I'm convinced that it will not be with the same fury and personal attack that has been cast on Doc.   Big donors brought us Snyder, how did that work out? 

My final comment on this, and you've seen it in writing from me (if you're honest, you'll recognize I've said this many times) is that our biggest problem isn't Doc, it's clearly the approach Hamrick takes toward with the general public, and the decisions made with / for the growing number of younger donors who are giving more now than the long time, older (but consistent) donors.  The re-seating cost the two programs a lot, and the fact that he looks past so many people who may have disagreed with him in the past is not overcome-able IMHO.

Oh I agree with all those reasons. But imo Doc is the biggest reason. Doc never got an offer for an OC or DC for a reason. If you are good at it then there are coaches all over the country wanting you in those positions. They didn’t want him period!!! And it really irks me that he doesn’t wNt a dialogue with the fanbase. That is a huge part building a program. And Hamrick is just as bad when it comes to communication. Nothing would make me happier than see them both go. And I think I’ve said I’m not happy about the Toledo loss. But Toledo is much better in basketball than Rice in football. Regardless it shouldn’t have happened. And I think Danny will get a little more rope because he engages with fans and want them involved. He also plays a much more exciting game. And he doesn’t get near the resources Doc has got. And Dannys teams always get better as the year goes and gives you hope come tournament time. Doc always crashes and burns at the end and then usually wins some bowl game nobody cares about. Danny did something never done before at Marshall and gave us a huge amount of recognition that week. People make fun of the CIT but at least it was a tournament of 4 games we had to win and not just one like a low level bowl game. Just saying he gives you hope and excitement. Doc gives you depression and stagnation.

[MicDrass1]

So basically Holliday was hired because he was friends with the Marshall AD.  Is that what most feel happened.  I think the AD underestimated the recruiting of Snyder and thought Holliday would be a master recruiter.  Certainly at Marshall he has not been.  Evidenced by our NFL picks.  Think Snyder had more drafted than Holliday in a much shorter amount of time.  That's the only reason I could see any AD hiring a HC with 0 coordinator experience.  Either a close friend and recruiter or just a close friend.  Holliday had a few positive moments for the Herd but I drink more now than I did 11 years ago.  The wvu and vt games formed my opinion on Holliday.  He positively surprised twice as Herd HC (@ Loserville and MD bowl game).   That's just 2/150 games.  Not enough.