Topic: MBB schedule is out

[herdorbust2]

Appy State plays Auburn in Hickory, NC, an hour away from campus as part of a tournament. If indications of the Greenbrier are correct as posters pointed out above, I'd assume this is what we are trying to turn the Greenbrier into.

Our schedule is no worse than any other SBC team at this point and probably better than most, to be fair. Had the Cayman Islands Classic not fallen apart, you'd likely be playing at least one more P5 in Ole Miss, Wake Forest, or Cincinnati.

Are it's no worse than any other SB teams schedule. But I'm afraid we are going to ind ourselves just being at that level. The excuses are getting old. We have no business playing in a ball room with no seating. If we are going to keep thumbing our nose at Orehead and EKU then stick by better standards. If our coach wants to talk big time then act big time.

[Flat Tire 2]

Appy State plays Auburn in Hickory, NC, an hour away from campus as part of a tournament. If indications of the Greenbrier are correct as posters pointed out above, I'd assume this is what we are trying to turn the Greenbrier into.

Our schedule is no worse than any other SBC team at this point and probably better than most, to be fair. Had the Cayman Islands Classic not fallen apart, you'd likely be playing at least one more P5 in Ole Miss, Wake Forest, or Cincinnati.

FYI Per the Appy website, Appy is playing Auburn at home in Boone.
https://appstatesports.com/sports/mens-basketball/schedule

Appy is playing UNC Asheville in Hickory. App is opening a branch in Hickory so I guess the game is a public relations event.

HICKORY, N.C. ? The Mountaineers' men's basketball program is set to host UNC Asheville in the inaugural App State's Hickory Hoops Classic, December 21 at 7 p.m.
 The contest will be played at Catawba Valley Community College's Tarlton Complex and marks the first of a two-year home-and-home series with the Bulldogs. App State will play at Harrah's Cherokee Center - Asheville on November 14, 2024 as part of its 2024-25 nonconference schedule.

"This is going to be a very exciting series with a historic program like UNC Asheville. Competing against a great program that is coming off a NCAA Tournament appearance and Big South regular season and tournament championship will be a significant test for us in the non-conference," head coach Dustin Kerns said.
 
"With our Hickory campus opening this year as well, it will be very exciting to play a game in Hickory in front of so many alumni and fans who will continue to promote the App State brand in that area. In addition, the following year playing in the great city of Asheville and western North Carolina has always been a priority, and we are thrilled that it has all come to fruition."
 App State's Hickory Hoops Classic will be the fourth event hosted by the Mountaineers in Hickory since the new App State Hickory campus was announced in November 2021. Classes will begin on the campus in two weeks.

https://appstatesports.com/news/2023/8/8/mens-basketball-mountaineers-to-face-unc-asheville-in-app-states-hickory-hoops-classic.aspx

It appears that most of SBC members put most of their resources (money) in football and not in basketball. If MU decided it wanted to improve its basketball program, it could dominate the SBC in  just a few seasons.
 

[herdorbust2]

FYI Per the Appy website, Appy is playing Auburn at home in Boone.
https://appstatesports.com/sports/mens-basketball/schedule

Appy is playing UNC Asheville in Hickory. App is opening a branch in Hickory so I guess the game is a public relations event.

HICKORY, N.C. ? The Mountaineers' men's basketball program is set to host UNC Asheville in the inaugural App State's Hickory Hoops Classic, December 21 at 7 p.m.
 The contest will be played at Catawba Valley Community College's Tarlton Complex and marks the first of a two-year home-and-home series with the Bulldogs. App State will play at Harrah's Cherokee Center - Asheville on November 14, 2024 as part of its 2024-25 nonconference schedule.

"This is going to be a very exciting series with a historic program like UNC Asheville. Competing against a great program that is coming off a NCAA Tournament appearance and Big South regular season and tournament championship will be a significant test for us in the non-conference," head coach Dustin Kerns said.
 
"With our Hickory campus opening this year as well, it will be very exciting to play a game in Hickory in front of so many alumni and fans who will continue to promote the App State brand in that area. In addition, the following year playing in the great city of Asheville and western North Carolina has always been a priority, and we are thrilled that it has all come to fruition."
 App State's Hickory Hoops Classic will be the fourth event hosted by the Mountaineers in Hickory since the new App State Hickory campus was announced in November 2021. Cl(@/:; will begin on the campus in two weeks.

https://appstatesports.com/news/2023/8/8/mens-basketball-mountaineers-to-face-unc-asheville-in-app-states-hickory-hoops-classic.aspx

It appears that most of SBC members put most of their resources (money) in football and not in basketball. If MU decided it wanted to improve its basketball program, it could dominate the SBC in  just a few seasons.

And that is what is sad. Will we decide to dominate a conference that doesn't make basketball a priority? Or just fall back into the pack and hope to compete? Usually the Marshall way is just fall back and hope for the best. We will see if Spears and Smith change that thinking. But so far I'm not seeing basketball being any different.

[pembrook burrows III]

Interesting take by the above twitter account. A quick google search gave me the following information "CBB Nation. @CBBNation247. NCAA Basketball coverage with emphasis on mid-major & low-major programs." I am surprised that Voyles is listed on "Defensive POTY Watch" since he isn't on any of the all MEAC teams including the MEAC all defensive team for last year. Either this twitter account is not doing his research or the SBC is weaker in basketball then I thought.

https://meacsports.com/news/2023/3/7/meac-announces-2022-23-mens-basketball-all-conference-honors.aspx

Don't know, Flat, but not surprising that Voyles was not on any All-MEAC teams since he missed almost the entire month of February with an injury. That said, the choice of Voyles as at least a candidate for Sun Belt Defensive POTY may have arisen out of the fact that UMES was #1 in the nation in steals per game; #1 in the nation in turnovers forced per game; #66 in the nation in scoring defense. Voyles tied UMES teammate Zion Styles for a team best of 2.0 steals per game.

https://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-men/d1/current/team/215

https://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-men/d1/current/team/931

https://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-men/d1/current/team/146/p2

[herdorbust2]

Don't know, Flat, but not surprising that Voyles was not on any All-MEAC teams since he missed almost the entire month of February with an injury. That said, the choice of Voyles as at least a candidate for Sun Belt Defensive POTY may have arisen out of the fact that UMES was #1 in the nation in steals per game; #1 in the nation in turnovers forced per game; #66 in the nation in scoring defense. Voyles tied UMES teammate Zion Styles for a team best of 2.0 steals per game.

https://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-men/d1/current/team/215

https://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-men/d1/current/team/931

https://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-men/d1/current/team/146/p2

Right now I'm way more concerned about assists than steals. I'm trying to figure out where that is coming from.

[bighat]

It is very interesting that a player that has not played in the league is pick as POY on defense.  Would indicate that he has more talent than some are allowing him.

[Flat Tire 2]

Don't know, Flat, but not surprising that Voyles was not on any All-MEAC teams since he missed almost the entire month of February with an injury. That said, the choice of Voyles as at least a candidate for Sun Belt Defensive POTY may have arisen out of the fact that UMES was #1 in the nation in steals per game; #1 in the nation in turnovers forced per game; #66 in the nation in scoring defense. Voyles tied UMES teammate Zion Styles for a team best of 2.0 steals per game.

https://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-men/d1/current/team/215

https://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-men/d1/current/team/931

https://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-men/d1/current/team/146/p2

If you look at the MEAC all conference team, Voyles' teammate at Maryland Eastern Shore Zion Styles was third team all conference MEAC and was on the All Defensive MEAC team. He appears the best guard from Maryland Eastern Shore team, too bad we didn't get him! Watch his highlight video, Styles is a player! I realize that videos only show the player at his best, but Styles is good plus he was All MEAC defensive team. Plus MES had a 6'5" forward Nathan Pollard Jr from Richmond, VA who was second team All MEAC.

[chris88]

In the HD article about UK, Spears said that Marshall needs to be playing Quad 1 games.  Quad 1 games are : Quadrant one games are those home games vs. teams RPI ranked 1-30, neutral games vs. 1-50, and away games vs. 1?75. For example, a home win against a top 30 team would qualify as a quadrant one victory. Quadrant 2 are those games at home against the RPI 31?75, neutral 51?100, and away vs RPI 76?135.

So Spears, apparently, isn't thrilled with DD scheduling either. I would expect the next coach will be held to a higher standard.  With the NCAA bid in this league open for the taking we should be doing more.  Want to be a top 100 program, than schedule like one. If that means playing more road OOC games vs better teams than so be it. You have to start building towards what you want. When teams see you aren't killing their RPI they will be more likely to schedule you. All those confidence games last year didn't seem to mean anything as we lost in game one of tourney. I really like DD as a person but I think him getting a pass on the standard is unfair.

[gochneaur645]

In the HD article about UK, Spears said that Marshall needs to be playing Quad 1 games.  Quad 1 games are : Quadrant one games are those home games vs. teams RPI ranked 1-30, neutral games vs. 1-50, and away games vs. 1?75. For example, a home win against a top 30 team would qualify as a quadrant one victory. Quadrant 2 are those games at home against the RPI 31?75, neutral 51?100, and away vs RPI 76?135.

So Spears, apparently, isn't thrilled with DD scheduling either. I would expect the next coach will be held to a higher standard.  With the NCAA bid in this league open for the taking we should be doing more.  Want to be a top 100 program, than schedule like one. If that means playing more road OOC games vs better teams than so be it. You have to start building towards what you want. When teams see you aren't killing their RPI they will be more likely to schedule you. All those confidence games last year didn't seem to mean anything as we lost in game one of tourney. I really like DD as a person but I think him getting a pass on the standard is unfair.

Well said. Sounds like Spears gets it.

When most of our 18 Sun Belt games are going to be Quad 3 games, we need to make every OOC game count. No wasting them on bottom D-1 teams just because they're close or for the sake of tradition from 60 years ago nobody cares about. Ohio should be the only OOC game set in stone. No more than 1 other MAC team on top of them.

DD should have almost no input in the schedule if he doesn't want to play big name teams.

[herdorbust2]

Well said. Sounds like Spears gets it.

When most of our 18 Sun Belt games are going to be Quad 3 games, we need to make every OOC game count. No wasting them on bottom D-1 teams just because they're close or for the sake of tradition from 60 years ago nobody cares about. Ohio should be the only OOC game set in stone. No more than 1 other MAC team on top of them.

DD should have almost no input in the schedule if he doesn't want to play big name teams.

I agree with this if we play better teams. But we should never play 2 teams at that level other than Morehead and EKU. If you are going to play that type team, why not play rivals that you can travel to easily? Problem is I don't see us playing a schedule that plays every game better than those 2.

[miltonherdfan]

In the HD article about UK, Spears said that Marshall needs to be playing Quad 1 games.  Quad 1 games are : Quadrant one games are those home games vs. teams RPI ranked 1-30, neutral games vs. 1-50, and away games vs. 1?75. For example, a home win against a top 30 team would qualify as a quadrant one victory. Quadrant 2 are those games at home against the RPI 31?75, neutral 51?100, and away vs RPI 76?135.

So Spears, apparently, isn't thrilled with DD scheduling either. I would expect the next coach will be held to a higher standard.  With the NCAA bid in this league open for the taking we should be doing more.  Want to be a top 100 program, than schedule like one. If that means playing more road OOC games vs better teams than so be it. You have to start building towards what you want. When teams see you aren't killing their RPI they will be more likely to schedule you. All those confidence games last year didn't seem to mean anything as we lost in game one of tourney. I really like DD as a person but I think him getting a pass on the standard is unfair.

i also noticed in that article, he gave Calipari props for being willing to play the game, but said nothing in regards to Dan or our staff seeking out an opponent of that caliber

[pembrook burrows III]

If you look at the MEAC all conference team, Voyles' teammate at Maryland Eastern Shore Zion Styles was third team all conference MEAC and was on the All Defensive MEAC team. He appears the best guard from Maryland Eastern Shore team, too bad we didn't get him!

Nice player, but Styles was a graduate student with no further eligibility. Plus Voyles was a slightly better scorer and turned the ball over at only about half the rate of Styles.

Right now I'm way more concerned about assists than steals. I'm trying to figure out where that is coming from.

I share that concern with you, Bust. It would be great to have another veteran guard to lean on. In order for this year's team to have success, it will have to play differently than last year, where the ball would stick with Andy or Taevion at times. Both were ball dominant guards who liked to play the iso game.

Today's game is trending away from having a traditional PG. Forwards and even centers now are more skilled and able to play on the perimeter, handle the ball, and create. Take last year's FAU squad. Great team! But Kam Curfman had more assists than any player on FAU, and Kam had far fewer than either Andy or Taevion. All of the FAU players averaged less than 2.5 assists per game. Why? They moved and shared the ball, garnering 1 more assist as a team than Marshall did in 2022-2023.

That's the style we will need to play in 2023-2024 because we have no ball dominant guard. Of course we won't be as good as FAU, but the "athletic ball" that DD speaks of will be a necessity if this team is to have any chance at success IMO.

[miltonherdfan]

I agree with this if we play better teams. But we should never play 2 teams at that level other than Morehead and EKU. If you are going to play that type team, why not play rivals that you can travel to easily? Problem is I don't see us playing a schedule that plays every game better than those 2.

i wouldn't consider Morehead beneath us, either.  they go to NCAA a heckuva lot more often than we do!  morehead & ohio are quality-enough programs that they should both be on our OOC schedule every season.  there's no excuse for playing some of the schools we play & NOT play these 2 local schools.  as I've said before, i don't wanna play half of the MAC either, but at least they're D-I!  we have no business playing a regular season game vs Bluefield U or College of Bluefield or whatever they are?  how many cream puffs do we need on our schedule?  we already have 18 games vs SBC that the rest of the country laughs at, & dan seemingly just wants to pile more crap programs on top of those!  if he's that obsessed over having a winning record, perhaps he should step aside while he still has 1!

[herdorbust2]

Nice player, but Styles was a graduate student with no further eligibility. Plus Voyles was a slightly better scorer and turned the ball over at only about half the rate of Styles.

I share that concern with you, Bust. It would be great to have another veteran guard to lean on. In order for this year's team to have success, it will have to play differently than last year, where the ball would stick with Andy or Taevion at times. Both were ball dominant guards who liked to play the iso game.

Today's game is trending away from having a traditional PG. Forwards and even centers now are more skilled and able to play on the perimeter, handle the ball, and create. Take last year's FAU squad. Great team! But Kam Curfman had more assists than any player on FAU, and Kam had far fewer than either Andy or Taevion. All of the FAU players averaged less than 2.5 assists per game. Why? They moved and shared the ball, garnering 1 more assist as a team than Marshall did in 2022-2023.

That's the style we will need to play in 2023-2024 because we have no ball dominant guard. Of course we won't be as good as FAU, but the "athletic ball" that DD speaks of will be a necessity if this team is to have any chance at success IMO.

Glad you brought that up. But you are missing something. FAU alternated 2 bigs at the five spot. And everyone else was 6'4" or less!!! They could all handle the ball, were quick and could shoot. Danny has put together the opposite. Long, big 6'8 or bigger. Most can't shoot from 3 and can't handle near as good as FAU guards. It's night and day. I agree it's best to have more people that can handle, shoot and quick with the ball than just one PG. but we do t have that and actually have the opposite. Dusty May put together a team to fit the Dantoni style of play. Danny has recruited exactly the opposite. And it's mind boggling what he is doing trying to run his own system. Square peg round hole.

[gochneaur645]

i wouldn't consider Morehead beneath us, either.  they go to NCAA a heckuva lot more often than we do!  morehead & ohio are quality-enough programs that they should both be on our OOC schedule every season.

Like I said earlier in the thread, Morehead is usually good for their level and makes the tourney sometimes, but the OVC might be the easiest conference to get a bid from.

Bottom line is their average KenPom is 210 over the last 5 years so more often than not, they're going to hurt your strength of schedule. Not the worst team to schedule every once in awhile, but I don't think we need them every year.

[Herdmeister]

In the HD article about UK, Spears said that Marshall needs to be playing Quad 1 games.  Quad 1 games are : Quadrant one games are those home games vs. teams RPI ranked 1-30, neutral games vs. 1-50, and away games vs. 1?75. For example, a home win against a top 30 team would qualify as a quadrant one victory. Quadrant 2 are those games at home against the RPI 31?75, neutral 51?100, and away vs RPI 76?135.

So Spears, apparently, isn't thrilled with DD scheduling either. I would expect the next coach will be held to a higher standard.  With the NCAA bid in this league open for the taking we should be doing more.  Want to be a top 100 program, than schedule like one. If that means playing more road OOC games vs better teams than so be it. You have to start building towards what you want. When teams see you aren't killing their RPI they will be more likely to schedule you. All those confidence games last year didn't seem to mean anything as we lost in game one of tourney. I really like DD as a person but I think him getting a pass on the standard is unfair.

Spears has to give his approval on every game scheduled by tje basketball staff. In fact he signs every contact.

Sent from my SM-S918U1 using Tapatalk

[Herdmeister]

i also noticed in that article, he gave Calipari props for being willing to play the game, but said nothing in regards to Dan or our staff seeking out an opponent of that caliber

P5 games in tje mix were UK, UCONN and Cincinnati.
UCONN was quickly eliminated due to travel cost. We would have spent 50% of the check on travel expenses

Sent from my SM-S918U1 using Tapatalk

[Herdmeister]

I assume Mike D. still has a home at White Sulphur. Maybe he wanted the game played there?

The Greenbrier reached out to two teams with close proximity to the venue. It was perfect since we had been wanting to play Radford anyway.
As was mentioned, the Greenbrier will be hosting an MTE event next year and wanted to test their facility on a college game.
Many of the overseas MTE events, including Cancun, are played in ballrooms. Corny mentioned that Cleveland State played in two such events while he was there

Sent from my SM-S918U1 using Tapatalk

[thunderingon]

Glad you brought that up. But you are missing something. FAU alternated 2 bigs at the five spot. And everyone else was 6'4" or less!!! They could all handle the ball, were quick and could shoot. Danny has put together the opposite. Long, big 6'8 or bigger. Most can't shoot from 3 and can't handle near as good as FAU guards. It's night and day. I agree it's best to have more people that can handle, shoot and quick with the ball than just one PG. but we do t have that and actually have the opposite. Dusty May put together a team to fit the Dantoni style of play. Danny has recruited exactly the opposite. And it's mind boggling what he is doing trying to run his own system. Square peg round hole.

Would it be possible for you to wait and see how this team comes together and see the results? I hope this team makes you sound like a fool.  Voyles looks like a player and he shoots well. And a defensive upgrade.  I'm intrigued by Crawford and how he fits. Like its been said, we can't and don't have to replace Kinsey and Taylor's production with exact numbers. Its still a team game and as much as I loved those guys, the ball did slow down at times.  Its all about how these guy come together and run the system correctly.  Who's going to be the guy at the end of the game when we need a bucket?  We'll see.  Conner has the potential to take a big step this season.  Curffman is a guy that the opponents have to respect at all times. I really like what Martin brings to the table...seems to be a plug and play, pick and roll guy. OAK is OAK. What are we going to get from Fricks and McKey?  Theres a lot of potential there, so we'll see.  I just don't understand the constant negativity.

[chris88]

Spears has to give his approval on every game scheduled by tje basketball staff. In fact he signs every contact.

Sent from my SM-S918U1 using Tapatalk

Doesn't matter. What is AD suppose to do? Go back to coaches and say "10 OOC need to be better"?  What would DD do?.  Since the BB coaches do the scheduling it's on them to find the games that are worthy of a team that aspires to be a top 100 team. To your point, however, I think Spears should have an associate AD or himself completely take over the OOC portion of the schedule. Our staff could be giving the AD all the teams they called that said no, but i'd want to hear all of those conversations. I'm suggesting many teams won't play us because our overall schedule is too weak for them.  They could literally get anyone to play them closer than us with our SOS, so why would they play us? The risk/reward is bad deal for them. Seems to me the family name might be keeping the AD from holding the BB program to the standard. We've done it DD's way and don't get a sniff from NIT. Other teams of our budget level etc do it and we sit at home and wonder why. Confidence games are for the bottom third of a power conference not for a school who could easily be competing for top of league most every year.

[thunderingon]

I would expect the starting lineup to be:

Voyles
Curffman
Conner
Obinna
Martin

Then:
Fricks
McKey
Toussaint
Crawford
Goran

I just don't see the cupboard as being bare. I'm excited to see how it comes together.

[herdorbust2]

Would it be possible for you to wait and see how this team comes together and see the results? I hope this team makes you sound like a fool.  Voyles looks like a player and he shoots well. And a defensive upgrade.  I'm intrigued by Crawford and how he fits. Like its been said, we can't and don't have to replace Kinsey and Taylor's production with exact numbers. Its still a team game and as much as I loved those guys, the ball did slow down at times.  Its all about how these guy come together and run the system correctly.  Who's going to be the guy at the end of the game when we need a bucket?  We'll see.  Conner has the potential to take a big step this season.  Curffman is a guy that the opponents have to respect at all times. I really like what Martin brings to the table...seems to be a plug and play, pick and roll guy. OAK is OAK. What are we going to get from Fricks and McKey?  Theres a lot of potential there, so we'll see.  I just don't understand the constant negativity.

No I'm not waiting. Danny is a lazy recruiter and knows a third of this team can't produce a lick. Yet he is ok with that. And I don't think Voyles is a bad player at all. I don't think Martin is a bad player. But most of these guys don't fit his system at all. Why can't you see that? 2 of your starters and I agree they will start, can't short 3s at all. Martin didn't even attempt one last year. And Obinna has stretches where he misses 23 in a row. And they fit his system? What about Toussaint and Mckey? They can't shoot a lick outside. Who is the PG? I know I know, Obinna, Martin, Toussaint, Mckey and Goran are going to whip that ball around, penetrate and drive and really make the offense move. God forbid Voyle or Curfman needs a breather or worse, gets injured, Then what? Like PB2 said, FAU has it right for this system. Guards, guards and more guards.

[herdorbust2]

If ball rooms are so good then let's play them all in ball rooms across the country. We heard Dallas and the curtains were good also and it was pure low budget by CUSA. Maybe we can play a game at the rec center once a year?

[gochneaur645]

The Greenbrier reached out to two teams with close proximity to the venue. It was perfect since we had been wanting to play Radford anyway.
As was mentioned, the Greenbrier will be hosting an MTE event next year and wanted to test their facility on a college game.
Many of the overseas MTE events, including Cancun, are played in ballrooms. Corny mentioned that Cleveland State played in two such events while he was there

Why on earth have we been wanting to play Radford? Horrible team from a horrible conference.

[Flat Tire 2]

Nice player, but Styles was a graduate student with no further eligibility. Plus Voyles was a slightly better scorer and turned the ball over at only about half the rate of Styles.

Apparently the voters of the All MEAC basketball teams disagree with you.
.