Author Topic: Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...  (Read 4226 times)

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Offline W0lfman

Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
« on: March 04, 2005, 10:43:57 AM »
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  • Indeed, Bensel-Meyers and her group believe real reform won’t happen until Congress challenges the financial control the multibillion-dollar NCAA, with its so-called "nonprofit" status, has over the nation’s universities. In the meantime, the APR effort is in the hands of the coaches.

    And that, Maggard said, is the ultimate dilemma.

    "As long as coaches are hired and fired based on wins and losses, how much of an impact on them will APRs have?" he asked.

    That’s the key question. Will coaches listen to academic advisers like Maggard and leave marginal students behind, or will they follow the philosophy of Marshall football Coach Bobby Pruett, who said in a January interview that cheating is relative?

    "Rules and regulations are like the interstate out here," Pruett told the Huntington, W.V., Herald-Dispatch. "The speed limit is 65 miles an hour. And it’s acceptable to go 90 until you get a speeding ticket."

    In the minds of some coaches, it’s not cheating until you get caught. Bensel-Meyers worries the APRs will only encourage those types of coaches to cheat more and put more pressure on faculty members to pass their marginal student-athletes.

    If that happens, storm clouds might ruin Myles Brand’s beautiful new day.

    http://www.columbiatribune.com/2005/Mar/20050303Feat001.asp

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    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « on: March 04, 2005, 10:43:57 AM »

    Offline Thundering Lydia

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    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #1 on: March 04, 2005, 10:57:14 AM »
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  • I think that quote is taken out of context.  When Pruett spoke those words, I think he was referring to players pushing the limits of team rules.

    Am I wrong about that?
     

    Offline W0lfman

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #2 on: March 04, 2005, 11:06:51 AM »
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  • Here is the exact question and quote from the HD article they mention...

    Quote
    H-D: What are your overall thoughts on 2004? It was definitely a different kind of year, on the field and off the field. Looking back, what were the top moments and the biggest disappointments?

    PRUETT: In some ways we had some real gratifying things. We learned a lot about our program. We raised the bar and the standards of our program to the point that we’re competitive on the level with the Georgias and the Ohio States, and we were able to have a great win over Miami.

    We had some big disappointments. Troy State and Akron were two huge disappointments. Other things, our off the field distractions were a direct reflection of problems that resulted in the number of losses. You start the first game, we had five, six suspensions and then followed it off with all of the off the field distractions.

    It certainly paid a toll. It demonstrated that we have some work to do in the leadership department. When I talk about leadership I talk about on the field and off the field leadership. I think when we’re talking about more input in the area we’re talking about players and coaches and everything we do.

    We have to reassess that and we are doing some things. But I think that is a direct reflection. We’ve always in the past been able to win close ball games at the end and we weren’t able to this year, losing three or four games on the last play. I think that’s a direct reflection of all the combination of problems we had.

    I think the loss of 15 scholarships (while on NCAA probation) over the three years paid a major toll, along with the five players who were injured and couldn’t participate and the three academic casualties we had.

    If you go back and look the guy who was scheduled to be our field goal kicker was ineligible. We missed a field goal against Troy. We missed a field goal against Ohio State and we missed a field goal up at Akron. I don’t want to leave it on Ian (O’Connor), but those all factored in. There is no easy solution. They are all different factors in a season that we felt had great promise and did some great things.

    But we did not fulfill. We left the field with an empty feeling instead of a full feeling, and that’s a shame. Because that’s the first time since I’ve been here that we’ve done that.

    I think there are a lot of reasons for that. And as the football coach, I spend a lot of time assessing our season, every aspect of it in an evaluation of every player, every coach, every aspect of the thing in trying to assess what can we do better and what do we need to change, if anything. I’m not saying change is the answer, but where do we need to strengthen and get better.

    And we do that every year. But this year I think it’s extremely important, because we do have good players. We’re stepping into a new arena and we want to step into that new arena on a high instead of a low. I think we do have great expectations.

    I don’t want it (the 2004 season) to be such a downer. We did have some accomplishments. There were some reasons, some extenuating circumstances to being 6-6. Some of the things we couldn’t change. We can’t change the injuries. We can’t change the scholarship limitations. We can’t change those type of things but we can change attitudes and we can change effort. We can spark enthusiasm, and I think we can’t get in a routine of accepting and making excuses over what’s happened.

    Our football team reports on Monday, and when they do they need to be revitalized, rejuvenized. If we need to change some ways that we do things from a little thing about do we let them live off campus or stay in the dorm to our class attendance policies and policies off the field.

    Rules and regulations are like the Interstate out here. The speed limit is 65 miles an hour. And it’s acceptable to go 90 until you get a speeding ticket. I think we got a speeding ticket. Now we have to pay the ticket, like everybody else, to the point where it hurts.

    Offline Liv4daherd

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    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #3 on: March 04, 2005, 11:49:00 AM »
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  • That article really chaps my $(^ and was completely taken out of context!  You guys (Thundering Lydia, Wolf) are exactly right.  Somebody needs to call the author of the article to the carpet on this!
     

    Offline Max

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #4 on: March 04, 2005, 12:25:20 PM »
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  • The writer's email link is at the bottom of the original article.  We should begin flooding him with emails.  This is a prime example of journalistic laziness.
     

    Offline HerdZone

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    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #5 on: March 04, 2005, 12:29:12 PM »
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  • Whats the address to that link Wolf, Ive got an E-MAIL started to this guy and want to include this link.
     

    Offline HerdChemist89

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    « Reply #6 on: March 04, 2005, 12:44:56 PM »
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  • Man.

    Guys, nobody should be able to take anybody's words completely out of context like that and mention them in such a blasphemous way.

    That jacka$s just completely threw journalistic integrity out the window.

    I say we swamp his sorry a$s with with hate-mail and demand that he publish a recant of this horrible misquote.

    "Chaps my a$s" is right on the money. I am pi$sed.

    GO HERD
    Quote
    "For years we realized we needed an indoor practice facility," Pastilong said. "Former Gov. Caperton was sympathetic to our needs and enabled us with the financial assistance to carry out this project."
    Quote
    "We're going to monitor that car more closely," said Pastilong, who previous said the football staff had used the car for errands. "It's going to have a checkout sheet with an odometer reading and the purpose for using it."
     

    Offline Chris884mu

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    Boy that sounds like a slander lawsuit to me
    « Reply #7 on: March 04, 2005, 01:37:27 PM »
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  • or at least a retraction
     

    Offline Chris884mu

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    more info
    « Reply #8 on: March 04, 2005, 02:00:32 PM »
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  • Here are 2 more guys to write:

    jerobertson@tribmail.com
    jwalljasper@tribmail.com

    One is the paper's Managing Editor and the other is the Sports Editor (there is a link to the staff directory off the main page)

    I would think the school would have as good a case as Pruett.
     

    Online carolinaherdfan

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #9 on: March 04, 2005, 02:21:20 PM »
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  • That is an example of one piece of a disgraceful publicaton, that today we call journalism.  He was probably educated at Clemson U.; they seem to have a special way with words i.e. the truth IMO.  That is is the Bowden School of Journalism.  He graduated, and learned his abilities, at the same place Rich Rod was schooled.

    GO THUNDERINGHERD!

     :D
     

    Offline W0lfman

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #10 on: March 04, 2005, 02:38:47 PM »
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  • Quote
    Whats the address to that link Wolf, Ive got an E-MAIL started to this guy and want to include this link.
    This is the original link to the Q&A with coach Pruett  dated January 9th 05.  I hope its the link your referring to.

    http://www.herald-dispatch.com/2005/January/09/MUspot.htm

    Offline HerdZone

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    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #11 on: March 04, 2005, 04:51:21 PM »
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  • My Short E-MAIL to the guy.

    Quote
    Sir your quote of Bob Pruett in your artile "Dark storm clouds hover
    over NCAA reform effort" , wrote on March, 3 05, was taken clearly out
    of context of his words. In the "Q & A with Marshall's Bobby Pruett"
    in the H-D at http://www.herald-dispatch.com/2005/January/09/MUspot.htm,
    I believe you took your "Creative Journalism" of Preutt just a bit to
    far. As Preutt was refering to the students going 90mph on the
    interstate that only goes 65 and you put the quote in an article made
    it look like he was cheating the NCAA until he got caught again. I
    truly think you owe the man an apology.
     

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    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #11 on: March 04, 2005, 04:51:21 PM »

    Offline ThunderZone

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #12 on: March 04, 2005, 05:03:23 PM »
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  • Below is the reply from Mr. Messenger after the email that I wrote him...

    Quote
    Todd,
     
    Thanks for the note. Of course, I disagree with your opinion. I read the entire Q&A transcript from the interview with the West Virginia reporter before I wrote my column, and I've still got a copy.
     
    In fact, before the quote I used, Coach Pruett was indeed talking about the scholarship limitations that came from the NCAA as a result of its very well publicized investigation into the program.
     
    Further, the rest of the quote proves the point: "I think we got a ticket. Now we have to pay the ticket, like everybody else, to the point where it hurts."
     
    Clearly, he's responding to the NCAA allegations of misconduct. Whether he's putting it on the players or himself, he's indicating that it's OK to break the rules until you get caught. That was my point.
     
    Thanks for writing.
     
    Tony


     :x
     

    Offline HerdZone

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    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #13 on: March 04, 2005, 05:56:59 PM »
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  • And South Carolina the school in the city he reports for most often most likely, plays in the most crupt Conf there is the SEC.
     

    Offline mrherd05

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    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #14 on: March 04, 2005, 06:14:17 PM »
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  • I agree with the writer, Coach Pruett said that right there in black and white.

    Re read it a thousand times it still says the same thing.
     

    Offline Olen

    ARG...
    « Reply #15 on: March 04, 2005, 06:32:46 PM »
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  • Had this "reporter" or "columnist" (whatever title he wishes to attach) not  emailed ThunderZone a response, I could have given the reporter/columnist the benefit of the doubt on what Pruett may or may not have been referring to with the quote cherry-picked for inclusion in this article.  The reporter/columnist's email response to TZ grinds that "benefit of the doubt" into dust.

    Why the "Benefit of the Doubt"?

    The reader is not provided the context of the "conversation" between Pruett and the interviewer (Hanshaw, if I recall).  It is often difficult to know whether the print report of a Q&A is sequential, and whether the "A's" were edited for column space.

    In Pruett's twelve-paragraph response to the question, scholarship limitations due to NCAA sanctions is mentioned twice - the first time in the fifth paragraph, and was lumped in with injuries and academic casualties as probable causes to Marshall's fb struggles this season.  The second and last instance occurs in the tenth paragraph relative to things that the team could not change - scholarship limitations.  

    Pruett's use of "rules and regulations" is likely tied to the investigation and punishment by the reporter/columnist b/c it was the "rules and regulations" that Marshall violated.  Thus, the connection is not completely from left field.  

    However, there are at least two plausible interpretations (if not more) of the quoted statement - and that should have raised a flag for the reporter/columnist to perform a cursory investigation.  By contacting either Hanshaw or Pruett, or both, the proper interpretation could have been determined, and the reporter/columnist could have been assured that his assertion, and his use of the Pruett quote as support for that assertion, were accurate.  

    Why the Email to ThunderZone Undermines Any Benefit of the Doubt?

    The reporter/columnist wrote in the email:

    Quote
    In fact, before the quote I used, Coach Pruett was indeed talking about the scholarship limitations that came from the NCAA as a result of its very well publicized investigation into the program.

    Further, the rest of the quote proves the point: "I think we got a ticket. Now we have to pay the ticket, like everybody else, to the point where it hurts."

    Clearly, he's responding to the NCAA allegations of misconduct. Whether he's putting it on the players or himself, he's indicating that it's OK to break the rules until you get caught. That was my point.


    The reporter/columnist is simply wrong - before the Coach Pruett quote, Pruett was discussing this:

    Quote
    Our football team reports on Monday, and when they do they need to be revitalized, rejuvenized. If we need to change some ways that we do things from a little thing about do we let them live off campus or stay in the dorm to our class attendance policies and policies off the field.


    Pruett is discussing TEAM policy(ies), including living on/off campus, class attendance, and off the field activities (which most of us here and elsewhere have criticized to the nth degree).  The "we" in the quote is the team and program, not the athletic department or the university.  

    This paragraph is followed by:

    Quote
    Rules and regulations are like the Interstate out here. The speed limit is 65 miles an hour. And it’s acceptable to go 90 until you get a speeding ticket. I think we got a speeding ticket. Now we have to pay the ticket, like everybody else, to the point where it hurts.


    Pruett uses the phrase "[n]ow we have to pay the ticket..."  This clearly indicates a present and future payment, not a past payment.  Why is this significant in my mind?  Because, although the University is not off of NCAA probation until Dec. 21, 2005, the scholarship limitations had already expired.  Why would Pruett state that we have to continue paying for a ticket that the football program has already completed payment upon?  

    "Clearly" (to borrow from the reporter/columnist) Pruett's quote is more accurately and plausibly connected to the preceding paragraph (preceding in time - recency), largely because the team's failures stem predominantly from a lack of leadership, which is evident from the lax policy allowing players to live off campus, with little oversight, a less stringent class attendance requirement (relaxed from the policy during Pennington's time at Marshall), and the off the field (read:  bar) problems.    The "rules and regulations" Pruett is discussing in that quoted portion are the team rules and regs, and that the team incurred a heavy fine (lack of success), and that to get that success back, more stringent policies must be implemented (restricted off campus living, strict class attendance requirements, bars off limits) that the players will view as "hurting" (cutting down on the fun).  

    Furthermore, the university (as far as I can tell) NEVER blamed the players for the NCAA issue - the university took responsibility relative to the players, alleging that the university misunderstood the rules on proposition players and the university's role in getting said players employment.  It's difficult to understand why Pruett would even approach implicating the players as to blame for the NCAA problems.  That was the university's screw up.

    In sum, while plausible, the reporter/columnist's assertion is not reasonable based on the reasoning above.  If the reporter/columnist decides to investigate and provides that evidence for the reader to view, and the evidence demonstrates the reporter/columnist was right, then I will apologize.  Otherwise, in my opinion, the reporter/columnist brushes next to defamation for alleging that Pruett condones cheating until the cheater gets caught.  

    Someone should forward this information to Pruett, the AD and the President for investigation the plausibility of a defamation suit.
     

    Online carolinaherdfan

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #16 on: March 04, 2005, 07:56:57 PM »
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  • The reporter is filling space, and diverting attention from the Carolina program that has had a full plate lately with deviant behavior, and bad national press.

    Between Clemson and Carolina; the reporter would be working overtime to cover his two major in state programs.

    GO THUNDERINGHERD!

     :D
     

    Offline 2xBison

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #17 on: March 04, 2005, 08:04:41 PM »
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  • based on what Pruett was talking about.....it was clear to me he was talking about program rules and regulations.........i.e can't go certain places, curfews, etc...............they didn't follow the rules we had trouble now guys can't live off campus etc
    QB Club
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    Offline 2xBison

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #18 on: March 04, 2005, 08:09:04 PM »
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  • herd05........

    you need to read it again.  your interpretation comes from  your perspective of rules and regulations and your assumption he is speaking of the ncaa.......

    clearly, he was talking about the program and players and where they live.......he then talked about getting the ticket.

    certainly, you don't believe we don't have rules and regulations on the program independent of the ncaa??  do you?  and, if he was speaking of the ncaa rules and regulations, why didn't he speak of it while discussing  our scholly limits??

    i know you said you read it again and again, but perhaps you should read it and think while you read.
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    Offline W0lfman

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #19 on: March 05, 2005, 01:09:08 AM »
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  • Olen, a portion of your post below explains exactly how the writer took Pruett's quote of of context. And the more I read how he put BP's quote together with his piece the more pissed off I get about it.  The writer is way out of line in my opinion.

    Quote

    The reporter/columnist is simply wrong - before the Coach Pruett quote, Pruett was discussing this:

    Quote
    Quote:
    Our football team reports on Monday, and when they do they need to be revitalized, rejuvenized. If we need to change some ways that we do things from a little thing about do we let them live off campus or stay in the dorm to our class attendance policies and policies off the field.  


    Pruett is discussing TEAM policy(ies), including living on/off campus, class attendance, and off the field activities (which most of us here and elsewhere have criticized to the nth degree). The "we" in the quote is the team and program, not the athletic department or the university.

    This paragraph is followed by:

    Quote
    Quote:
    Rules and regulations are like the Interstate out here. The speed limit is 65 miles an hour. And it’s acceptable to go 90 until you get a speeding ticket. I think we got a speeding ticket. Now we have to pay the ticket, like everybody else, to the point where it hurts.


    Pruett uses the phrase "[n]ow we have to pay the ticket..." This clearly indicates a present and future payment, not a past payment. Why is this significant in my mind? Because, although the University is not off of NCAA probation until Dec. 21, 2005, the scholarship limitations had already expired. Why would Pruett state that we have to continue paying for a ticket that the football program has already completed payment upon?





    Offline Max

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #20 on: March 05, 2005, 07:14:40 AM »
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  • The columnist in question is writing from Columbia, Missouri, not Columbia, SC.
     

    Offline ThunderZone

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #21 on: March 05, 2005, 10:40:29 AM »
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  • Olen you stated everything that I was feeling, but didn't feel like taking the time to put it into words...Thank you...I have to be careful with inner office email as well as with customers...I've had my messages misconstrued time after time because they were taken out of context and they don't read the way I had intended.

    To me this is obviously the case here as you describe so well...He took random thoughts and quotes and pieced them together to fit his agenda...When Coach used the speed limit analogy he wasn't even referring to what the writer leads you to believe.

    Great work Olen ... Like Wolf states above, the more I read it the more furious I become.
     

    HerdFans.com

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #21 on: March 05, 2005, 10:40:29 AM »

    Offline HERDFAN1999

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #22 on: March 05, 2005, 12:27:41 PM »
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  • I agree this article isn't worth the paper it was on.  Does anyone know if BP has read it?  I wonder what his response is?
    "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms.  The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government." - - Thomas Jefferson

     

    Offline Chevy1

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #23 on: March 06, 2005, 10:59:26 AM »
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  • the Herald-Dispatch writer could have put into parentheses the context of the statement which would eliminated all confusion.

    Of course, in the end, this is just another example of why you must be very careful with your choice of words during a media interview.  Who knows how a writer is going to use those words - in reality, they can edit anyway they choose - it might be an innocent edit to save space.  For example, Pruett might have began his statement with something like, "As far as the players and rules are concerned,"...  The newspaper writer might have assumed that since the discussion before Pruett's quote was dealing with player rules, the natural conclusion would have been his speeding statement would have automatically been associated with the players.  However, there were statements within the same interview concerning NCAA sanctions.  In the end, the writer should have made it crystal clear of the context of Pruett's statement.

    As far as the journalist from Columbia is concerned, just another example of developing a story line and then searching for facts to support that position.  He saw Pruett's quote as something to latch onto.  Although Pruett's subject (players or NCAA investigation) in the response is muddy at best, our reporter or columnist or HACK decided to interpret Pruett's comments in the manner that best fit his column.  Sad but true .... it's the world of journalism which gave birth to the line, "don't let the facts get in the way of a good story."
    "The man who reads nothing at all is better educated than the man who reads nothing but newspapers." - Thomas Jefferson
     

    HerdFans.com

    Bob Pruett's quote in Columbia SC online paper...
    « Reply #23 on: March 06, 2005, 10:59:26 AM »