Topic: It's the schedule, stupid...

[ought-three]

   Notice how 10-4 wasn't enough to get us into the Top 25 last year? We were 29th, right behind a 12-2 Northern Illinois and 11-2 Fresno State, followed by a bunch of 9-4 and 10-4 teams from big conferences.

   There's only one reason - schedule. I'm going to be realistic about any chances we have about ranking in the polls. And forget the computers. They use a winning margin cap to ensure that teams with weak schedules can't rise by thrashing weak foes.

   Let's nip this Rodney Dangerfield stuff before we get too disappointed before the season even starts. It's going to be a good year, embrace that fact. Don't spend too much time fretting about national respect and voter respect because it isn't going to come. This would be a good year to jump on the "Just win, baby" bandwagon because we should do plenty of that.

[svherd]

If we go undefeated or possibly 11-1, I would bet that we will be ranked. That's all we can ask for. Jmo

[jstherd]

ought-three, I have copied your post, because at the end of the season I;m going to send it to you - when we're ranked in the top 25.

[Dunk]

Why are you calling everybody stupid as if you are the only person who comprehends schedule strength?

Everybody already knows your obvious statement, and I haven't seen anybody speak counter to your points. Of course 10-4 wasn't enough last year considering who the losses were to. Nobody is expecting us to be ranked in that scenario.

However, if we happen to "just win baby" the whole season it is a different story, and that is all people are talking about.

If you are going to insult people, and assert yourself as being more enlightened then at least make sure you are arguing against some real beliefs. Right now you are just battling your own imagination of what others think.

[QuickStrike]

   Notice how 10-4 wasn't enough to get us into the Top 25 last year? We were 29th, right behind a 12-2 Northern Illinois and 11-2 Fresno State, followed by a bunch of 9-4 and 10-4 teams from big conferences.

   There's only one reason - schedule. I'm going to be realistic about any chances we have about ranking in the polls. And forget the computers. They use a winning margin cap to ensure that teams with weak schedules can't rise by thrashing weak foes.

It wasn't the schedule last seson.....it was the losses.  If we beat Ohio, VT, MTSU, then beat FAU by a wider margin, we make top 25 with only a loss to Rice.

Same thing this year.  Despite the schedule we have to win and limit losses. With this year's schedule we win them all and poll votes will take care of itself.

[Buffalo Bop]

Bring on the wins!

[bbcard1]

Ought-three, if you want to get right on that, you feel free.

I am sick of people whining about 1) stuff we cannot control and 2) things that happened five years ago. If we lose to the Ohios, MTSUs and Rices of the world, we don't belong being ranked.  I'll come to the games anyway.

[BHFIOHIO]

and the HOD Bowl vs either Big 10 or Big 12 for CUSA champ. All good things for those who wait.

[_sturt_]

I've been among the chief antagonists on this point, and what concerns me is the mere fact that we're finding contentment in the idea that if we go undefeated we might land in the top 25.

Do you even hear yourselves?

That's a pretty significant lowering of our standards.

Top 25 should be a given if we go undefeated.

Top 25 is a nice achievement, but the real prize... both in terms of money and in terms of prestige... is being the school selected for a CFP Bowl.

It's not going to happen unless we take some definitive measures, either as a conference or on our own, to overcome our FBS bottom-feeder conference schedule.

"Win Baby"... yes, absolutely.

"Just" Win Baby? *sigh*... that phrase is going to haunt so many of you when, at the end of this season, we're undefeated and see ourselves looking up at 1-3 other Go5 schools who lost one or more.

If you think about it, you're actually letting our players down by pretending it's only about what they do on the field.

I know the refrain. And, you're right... none of you individually have decision-making power.

But you have to be an advocate of change so that you create an environment where presidents and conference execs take notice and feel they have latitude to try things that may represent out-of-the-box thiking... so that our players have the very best opportunity they can receive to perform on the biggest stage within their grasp to play on.

[goherd24]

We appear in the top 25 in week 4 if we go 3-0 to start the season and are receiving votes to begin. We appear at 5-0 if we don't get votes to start. Feel free to save this post. If we botch it up in any of our first 5 games, we dont sniff it til we are in week 11 at 10-1. A loss to any of our first 5 opponents drops us off the map in a hurry and dismissed as a cupcake schedule after thought. 7 of our opponents are already revealed in usa today. At 97 or worse (including RI) we can forget all talk of an access bowl with 1 loss for sure. We have to just win baby and enjoy the ride.

[backontrack]

The key is "enjoy"...last year's home games were as much fun as one can have with his clothes on...

[wasbarryb]

I wonder how people can look back on a team that was ranked 29 with a 10-4 record and predict next year we’ll be out of the top 25 with a 13-0 record. Strikes me that some people want to divorce themselves from reality and whine no matter what.

I’m not willing to promise we’ll go 13-0, but I’m sure we’ll be in the top 25 if we do go 13-0.

[_sturt_]

I wonder how people can...

It's the schedule, stupid...

I've been among the chief antagonists on this point, and what concerns me is the mere fact that we're finding contentment in the idea that if we go undefeated we might land in the top 25.

Do you even hear yourselves?

That's a pretty significant lowering of our standards.

Top 25 should be a given if we go undefeated.

Top 25 is a nice achievement, but the real prize... both in terms of money and in terms of prestige... is being the school selected for a CFP Bowl.

It's not going to happen unless we take some definitive measures, either as a conference or on our own, to overcome our FBS bottom-feeder conference schedule...

[2xBison]

We almost made top 25 in 1997 with 3 losses, first year in 1-a

[wasbarryb]

Quote from: wasbarryb on Today at 04:26:35 PM
I wonder how people can...

Quote from: ought-three on Today at 04:26:35 PM
It's the schedule, stupid...

Quote from: _sturt_ on Today at 04:26:35 PM
I've been among the chief antagonists on this point, and what concerns me is the mere fact that we're finding contentment in the idea that if we go undefeated we might land in the top 25.

Do you even hear yourselves?

That's a pretty significant lowering of our standards.

Top 25 should be a given if we go undefeated.

Top 25 is a nice achievement, but the real prize... both in terms of money and in terms of prestige... is being the school selected for a CFP Bowl.

It's not going to happen unless we take some definitive measures, either as a conference or on our own, to overcome our FBS bottom-feeder conference schedule...

Stupid am I? I don’t think so, I am also not gutless.

How about this Mr. Internet windbag. A little bet right now in front of everyone. $100.00. If we go 13-0 and aren’t ranked in the top 25 I write a $100.00 check to the Big Green in your name. If we go 13-0 and are ranked in the top 25 you write a $100 check to the Big Green in my name. If you’re right you not only get to say told you so, you actually contribute to the Big Green for apparently the first time in your life.

[goherd24]

Quote from: wasbarryb on Today at 04:26:35 PM
I wonder how people can...

Quote from: ought-three on Today at 04:26:35 PM
It's the schedule, stupid...

Stupid am I. I don’t think so, I am so not gutless.

How about this Mr. Internet windbag. A little bet right now in front of everyone. $100.00. If we go 13-0 and aren’t ranked in the top 25 I write a $100.00 check to the Big Green in your name. If we go 13-0 and are ranked in the top 25 you write a $100 check to the Big Green in my name. If you’re right you not only get to say told you so, you actually contribute to the Big Green for apparently the first time in your life.

I second this. 100%.

[Collis P]

I don't think they read your post _sturt_

[_sturt_]

I don't think they read your post _sturt_

hehe... I think you're right, Collis... not only that, I don't think barry in particular read the topic header, let alone the original post, just judging from his question... *smiling sigh, rolling eyes, nodding head*

But I'm only too happy to accept that bet if we can concern ourselves with what's really actually important... as really and actually stated in my post.

[BHFIOHIO]

Conf Champ and HOD vs Big 10 or Big 12 and I am ecstatic. Two yrs ago it was fire Doc, fire Doc.  How soon we forget. Just win. Just win. Just win.

[wasbarryb]

But I'm only too happy to accept that bet if we can concern ourselves with what's really actually important... as really and actually stated in my post.

Trying to cut through your incessant babbling. No shortage of insults, little substance. My bet was fairly clear, your rambling is vague as usual. What exactly are you offering as the measurable terms of any bet?

[Greg H]

Good God.  13-0 is a legitimate possibility and people are still screaming.

[The Right Stuff]

WIN!

TRS
MU 71

[Dunk]

I've been among the chief antagonists on this point, and what concerns me is the mere fact that we're finding contentment in the idea that if we go undefeated we might land in the top 25.

Do you even hear yourselves?

That's a pretty significant lowering of our standards.

Top 25 should be a given if we go undefeated.

Top 25 is a nice achievement, but the real prize... both in terms of money and in terms of prestige... is being the school selected for a CFP Bowl.

It's not going to happen unless we take some definitive measures, either as a conference or on our own, to overcome our FBS bottom-feeder conference schedule.

"Win Baby"... yes, absolutely.

"Just" Win Baby? *sigh*... that phrase is going to haunt so many of you when, at the end of this season, we're undefeated and see ourselves looking up at 1-3 other Go5 schools who lost one or more.

If you think about it, you're actually letting our players down by pretending it's only about what they do on the field.

I know the refrain. And, you're right... none of you individually have decision-making power.

But you have to be an advocate of change so that you create an environment where presidents and conference execs take notice and feel they have latitude to try things that may represent out-of-the-box thiking... so that our players have the very best opportunity they can receive to perform on the biggest stage within their grasp to play on.

I actually read your post, and I know that you are not just siding with the OP. Your comments are relevant, but you cannot expect change that quickly. Everybody knows that we would like to take a step up against better competition.

That will come with time, but right now we cannot control that. Even our schedule this year would have been better had it not been for some strange circumstances. We should (and will be) playing 1-2 bigger schools each year OOC.

Nobody is lowering their standards. They are enjoying the moment as we are rising to the point we want to achieve. We would all like to go as far as a national championship, but you simply cannot get there in your insane time frame with the resources we have at our disposal. Over time we would all like to move on to a more competitive conference, but we have to prove our worth where we are today.

In Summary: We all want to reach for the stars just as you do, but we have to keep our ambitions grounded in reality. You can only expect so much improvement in a given time period.

However there was one blatantly false statement in your post that I would like to address:
TOP 25 IS STILL A GIVEN IF WE GO UNDEFEATED. To think any differently is mind-boggling ignorant. There is 0% chance of us not being in the top 25 if we are undefeated. We will likely be in that grouping after the first few weeks assuming we win.

ENJOYING THE MOMENT AND BEING CONTENT WITH THE CURRENT SUCCESS THAT IS WITHIN YOUR CONTROL DOES NOT MEAN THAT YOU ARE OK WITH STAYING STAGNANT FOREVER. STOP ACTING LIKE YOU ARE IN SOME SELECT GROUP THAT ARE THE ONLY ONES PURSUING PROGRESS.  

[_sturt_]

I actually read your post, and I know that you are not just siding with the OP. Your comments are relevant, but you cannot expect change that quickly. Everybody knows that we would like to take a step up against better competition.

That will come with time, but right now we cannot control that. Even our schedule this year would have been better had it not been for some strange circumstances. We should (and will be) playing 1-2 bigger schools each year OOC.

Nobody is lowering their standards. They are enjoying the moment as we are rising to the point we want to achieve. We would all like to go as far as a national championship, but you simply cannot get there in your insane time frame with the resources we have at our disposal.

In Summary: We all want to reach for the stars just as you do, but we have to keep our ambitions grounded in reality. You can only expect so much improvement in a given time period.

However there was one blatantly false statement in your post that I would like to address:
TOP 25 IS STILL A GIVEN IF WE GO UNDEFEATED. To think any differently is mind-boggling ignorant. There is 0% chance of us not being in the top 25 if we are undefeated. We will likely be in that grouping after the first few weeks assuming we win.

ENJOYING THE MOMENT AND BEING CONTENT WITH THE CURRENT SUCCESS THAT IS WITHIN YOUR CONTROL DOES NOT MEAN THAT YOU ARE OK WITH STAYING STAGNANT FOREVER. STOP ACTING LIKE YOU ARE IN SOME SELECT GROUP THAT ARE THE ONLY ONES PURSUING PROGRESS.  

Dunk, I'm not sure you've been exposed to the several posts over the last several months that have indicated a disturbingly MAC-fan-like contentment with this conference (and naturally, the opponents we are expected to play year-in-year-out) as-is. Those many posts stand in opposition to your assumption that you're speaking for them in suggesting that "we all want to reach for the stars."

To the contrary, even in this very thread, there is a sentiment that striving for the CFP Bowl berth is beyond us... and it's just not. There's a satisfaction with Top 25 as-if that's all we can hope for... and it's just not. If you can agree on those points, we have common ground... if not, we don't, and you essentially align yourself with the MAC-like contingent.

I'm inclined to think that you, as others seem to have, read a few lines and thought you understood the point of the post... but if you didn't recognize that those first lines were a premise to the real focus/conclusion, my message just didn't get through... if I'm to blame for that, so be it... but then, let me just say again...

"Win Baby"... yes, absolutely.

"Just" Win Baby? *sigh*... that phrase is going to haunt so many of you when, at the end of this season, we're undefeated and see ourselves looking up at 1-3 other Go5 schools who lost one or more.

If you think about it, you're actually letting our players down by pretending it's only about what they do on the field.

I know the refrain. And, you're right... none of you individually have decision-making power.

But you have to be an advocate of change so that you create an environment where presidents and conference execs take notice and feel they have latitude to try things that may represent out-of-the-box thinking... so that our players have the very best opportunity they can receive to perform on the biggest stage within their grasp to play on.

Finally... a re-read hopefully will reveal to you what it seemed to reveal in Collis' (and hopefully others') first read... I feel like top 25 is, at least, very likely with an undefeated season. High fives all around. Hallelujah! How exciting!!!

Hopefully the sarcasm gets through...

Brothers, the point isn't to be top 25... no one remembers what MAC or Sun Belt teams creeped into the top 25 in any given year... and, repeating myself, it's unfortunate that so many are so willing to embrace that, and then by virtue of how they've responded for my pleas for them to be advocates for change, willing to be distracted from the one true goal that ought to rightfully dominate any discussion we have... there is only one measure of success for Go5 teams... and to pretend otherwise is to willfully be... well... pretenders.

[_sturt_]

Trying to cut through your incessant babbling. No shortage of insults, little substance. My bet was fairly clear, your rambling is vague as usual. What exactly are you offering as the measurable terms of any bet?

barry, do you get it that I didn't insult you?... that, rather, ought-three's original post answered what you "wondered," and given it's title, it's hard to have "wondered" unless you didn't bother reading the topic you clicked on?... I'm not sure you do.

As to the terms I would endorse in a bet, maybe what I just posted in response to Dunk helps... if not, I've got nothing for you... but if so, and if you actually think there's a chance I'd be proven wrong, let's go for it, friend.