Author Topic: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers  (Read 3721 times)

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Offline banker

Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
« on: October 02, 2016, 09:09:52 PM »
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  • Okay, here's what I did, I went to the 247 Sports and Rivals trying to build a complete list of every recruit who signed a LOI between 2011 and 2015 to calculate how many of those that signed completed their eligibility as a Marshall University football player.  I'm not drawing distinctions among the reasons they left, just the fact that they did not play their senior year at Marshall.  I didn't count the 2010 class because it was a rush job and had horrorific attrition.  I didn't include 2016 because we won't know how the props work out until next year.  The years 2013, 14 and 15 are still active as to who may not finish, so counts are as of today.

    Number of LOIs each year, # of 4 stars, # of 3 stars, # of 2 stars

    2011 - 26 - 0 - 17 - 9
    2012 - 22 - 1 - 7 - 14
    2013 - 22 - 2 - 11 - 9
    2014 - 26 - 1 - 14 - 11
    2015 - 26 - 0 - 14 - 12
    Tot. - 122 - 4 - 63 - 55

    Number that won't be Seniors here, 4s, 3s, 2s

    2011 - 11 - 0 - 7 - 4
    2012 - 15 - 1 - 5 - 9
    2013 - 10 - 1 - 5 - 4
    2014 - 10 - 0 - 6 - 4
    2015 -  9 - 0 - 6 - 3
    Tot. - 55 - 2 - 29 - 24

    Attrition rate

    2011 - 42%, 8% a year based on 5 years for eligibility.
    2012 - 68%, 13% per year
    2013- 45%, 11% per year (4 years)
    2014 - 38%, 13% per year (3 years)
    2015 - 34%, 17% per years (2 years)

    Overall 45% of the players who signed an LOI between 2011 and 2015 (55/122) are already assured of not playing a senior season here. That includes 7 three star or higher defensive backs or safeties.  I think it's no coincidence that 2011 was our best retained class and 2014 was our best season.  It is very concerning that our annual attrition rate is increasing as that is what will keep us perpetually young from an experience POV.
     

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    Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « on: October 02, 2016, 09:09:52 PM »

    Offline svherd

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #1 on: October 02, 2016, 09:47:28 PM »
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  • Is it that Doc is recruiting kids he knows will need a short leash and hope they stay out of trouble? If that seems to be the issue, he needs to rethink the kind of kids he recruits. Great information, thanks!


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    Offline HerdHead

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #2 on: October 03, 2016, 05:43:45 AM »
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  • +1
     

    Offline herd2win

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #3 on: October 03, 2016, 05:50:39 AM »
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  • Sounds like we need to go back to recruiting 2 star guys and coach them up to be 4 stars...
     

    Offline thunderingon

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #4 on: October 03, 2016, 07:08:59 AM »
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  • Sounds like we need to go back to recruiting 2 star guys and coach them up to be 4 stars...

    Then folks can slam him like they do D'Antonio.  Coaches can't win with this fan base. 
     
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    Offline biggreenarms

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    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #5 on: October 03, 2016, 07:11:03 AM »
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  • Thanks banker. It would be curious to see how this compares to our peers in C-USA. Not asking for you or anybody to do the leg work, just wondering if others like WKU, MTSU, etc have similar attrition.
     

    Online 2xBison

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #6 on: October 03, 2016, 07:27:35 AM »
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  • Sounds like we need to go back to recruiting 2 star guys and coach them up to be 4 stars...
    I am confident Doc would boot plenty of them as well
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    Offline The E-Man

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #7 on: October 03, 2016, 09:09:21 AM »
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  • Overall 45% of the players who signed an LOI between 2011 and 2015 (55/122) are already assured of not playing a senior season here. That includes 7 three star or higher defensive backs or safeties.  I think it's no coincidence that 2011 was our best retained class and 2014 was our best season.  It is very concerning that our annual attrition rate is increasing as that is what will keep us perpetually young from an experience POV.

    This theory applies to what Marcbuff thinks will happen in 2017.

    ??? Still, have a good chance to win CUSA or at least enough for a bowl game. This team is young. 2017 is ours.

    We seem to be getting younger and younger every year. I agree with other Herd fans, this is a major concern losing so many players. Hell, Cole Garvin just led South Alabama to an upset of #18 San Diego State. We could have use Cole as a legitimate backup QB this year.
     

    Offline banker

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #8 on: October 03, 2016, 09:48:22 AM »
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  • I found this, can't vouch for the accuracy, but looks reasonable.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/CFB/comments/2y4waq/power_5_conference_attrition_rates_for_2002/
     

    Offline herdman22

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #9 on: October 03, 2016, 11:42:29 AM »
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  • Probably should include here that only 52.9% of students who enter college complete with a degree in 6 years, and that number is going down.
     
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    Offline The Right Stuff

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #10 on: October 03, 2016, 11:46:16 AM »
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  • Great job Banker.

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    Offline saherdfan

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #11 on: October 03, 2016, 09:30:34 PM »
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  • Tell u what I like the 6'7 basketball recruiting avenue.  Maybe we can take a look at these guys more.   
     

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    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #11 on: October 03, 2016, 09:30:34 PM »

    Offline Pinkerton99

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #12 on: October 03, 2016, 11:47:00 PM »
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  • That is on par with the general Marshall student population of 47% graduating.
    « Last Edit: October 03, 2016, 11:55:25 PM by Pinkerton99 »
    Note: I'm not Eric Pinkerton.

     

    Offline IM4DHERD

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #13 on: October 04, 2016, 12:34:55 AM »
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  • I think you would have to temper those numbers with those who left due to better athletes being recruited into their positions, for instance quarterbacks who saw the writing on the wall and transfered for what they perceived as a better chance of playing time,  and those lost to legitimate reasons, a la Butler and at least one AJL if not two.
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    Offline MUinDE

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #14 on: October 04, 2016, 04:20:49 AM »
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  • I think you would have to temper those numbers with those who left due to better athletes being recruited into their positions, for instance quarterbacks who saw the writing on the wall and transfered for what they perceived as a better chance of playing time,  and those lost to legitimate reasons, a la Butler and at least one AJL if not two.

    You're missing the point.  Doc recruited all of these guys, even those with problems that we lost for legitimate reasons and those that are supposedly not developing as a player.  Doc should either recruit better human beings or start doing something about retention.  This repeating mantra that "we're young this year" doesn't cut it anymore.  We're young because we're losing roughly half our recruits leaving us with so few upperclassmen. As for a large portion transferring because they perceive they have a better chance at playing time, I'm sure that's part of it.  But, it doesn't seem to be as big a problem with other programs and didn't use to be with us.
     
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    Offline svherd

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #15 on: October 04, 2016, 08:03:11 AM »
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  • Solich rarely plays a freshmen or sophomore. Most of OU's starters are RS Juniors or RS Seniors. That's why that program has whipped our butts 4 of the last 5 times and been to 7 bowls in a row. Just an example on recruiting kids and keeping them in the program for the duration. Not saying OU has the better program but have to admit they have made huge strides and are consistent.


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    Offline BHFIOHIO

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #16 on: October 04, 2016, 09:48:06 AM »
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  • plus the recovered fumbles in the end zone and 5 picks from a Fr QB didn't help.
     

    Offline HerdHead

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #17 on: October 04, 2016, 10:04:12 AM »
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  • plus the recovered fumbles in the end zone and 5 picks from a Fr QB didn't help.

    Ok, what was the score in the second half, when we were desperate to score and we DIDN'T turn the ball over??
     

    Offline BHFIOHIO

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #18 on: October 04, 2016, 10:26:57 AM »
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  • and if the coach is so great how come no MAC champs? Even with the QB RB combo a coupla yrs ago? Lost to Tx St first game this yr. Not impressed with the Bobcats. He is a decent coach but not the guru some make him out to be.
     
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    Offline Herdalum83

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #19 on: October 04, 2016, 10:33:54 AM »
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  • and if the coach is so great how come no MAC champs? Even with the QB RB combo a coupla yrs ago? Lost to Tx St first game this yr. Not impressed with the Bobcats. He is a decent coach but not the guru some make him out to be.

    No one is saying he's a guru. Just a better gameday coach than Doc and he is. Look you can blame the losses to Ohio on turnovers, but the bottom line is the Bobcats deserve credit for a fair amount of the turnovers we had against them. If it would have just been that game with a freshman Cato where the turnover bug bit us against them, then you could call it a fluke. But, when the turnover bug bites you four or five times against the same team, then there is a good chance that team is causing a few of them.
     

    Offline svherd

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #20 on: October 04, 2016, 10:37:42 AM »
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  • and if the coach is so great how come no MAC champs? Even with the QB RB combo a coupla yrs ago? Lost to Tx St first game this yr. Not impressed with the Bobcats. He is a decent coach but not the guru some make him out to be.

    The point is, they recruit kids that stay in the program and rarely have to play freshmen or sophomores. Doc needs to learn this. Dig?


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    Online Flat Tire 2

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #21 on: October 04, 2016, 10:38:37 AM »
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  • Got to agree Solich has our number. Remember. Solich was head coach at Nebraska where he was 58-19, he just didn't please their fans (sound familiar). He has done a nice job at Ohio U.

    How many championships has Doc won?
    « Last Edit: October 04, 2016, 10:56:37 AM by Flat Tire 2 »
     

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    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #21 on: October 04, 2016, 10:38:37 AM »

    Offline iherdya

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #22 on: October 04, 2016, 11:19:08 AM »
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  • Got to agree Solich has our number. Remember. Solich was head coach at Nebraska where he was 58-19, he just didn't please their fans (sound familiar). He has done a nice job at Ohio U.

    How many championships has Doc won?

    100% more than solich in half the time
     
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    Offline HerdHead

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #23 on: October 04, 2016, 11:27:40 AM »
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  • Yet Solich consistently beats Doc head-to-head with a team full of players Doc wouldn't even think about recruiting.
     

    Offline wasbarryb

    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #24 on: October 04, 2016, 11:29:29 AM »
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  • I'd gladly do an even trade of Doc for Solich, any day of the week.
     
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    Re: Marshall Recruiting - Inside the Numbers
    « Reply #24 on: October 04, 2016, 11:29:29 AM »